guys…is the time…this month is the time:D
Nothing changes for users who find themselves already well served by some other rendering solution, for some other intended output. If you don’t feel like you need it, don’t get it. You’re still getting what looks to be a very significant product update for free. The Keyshot Bundle was only ever icing on the cake for certain users.
But it fills a gap in access to a high end rendering solution for a significant portion of the user base, and is priced to be accessible to hobbyists. People who already use professional grade rendering solutions don’t need it, but many industry pros still like to use Keyshot for rapid concept and visualization purposes, before setting up an extensive scene in a more elaborate renderer for animation or other purposes.
No one expects you to buy something that doesn’t benefit you. But it is going to benefit many people, hobbyists and pros alike.
I’m not arguing the value of the Keyshot deal, Spyndel. I checked the price of Keyshot, standalone, and getting a
fully-functional version of the program w/a bridge to Zbrush – at the price that’s been quoted – is a great bargain.
And I’m not feeling pressured to buy Keyshot…just tempted. 
And torn. I fear if I don’t buy the bridge, I might regret it. Then again…well, I count five render engines on this system,
already. And Modo’s reminds me a lot of Keyshot.
It’s an individual decision, I guess.
You’re still getting what looks to be a very significant product update for free. The Keyshot Bundle was only ever icing on the cake for certain users.
For 10 years, I’ve been awed by Pixologic’s generosity, in giving us free upgrades. I am deeply grateful for that generosity. I am also very grateful for this free upgrade and the chance to demo the 64 bit version of Zbrush. If I indicated otherwise, I am very sorry.
Thanks for the response. 
Edit:
Also, this was at the root of my first inquiry:
People who already use professional grade rendering solutions don’t need it, but many industry pros still like to use Keyshot for rapid concept and visualization purposes, before setting up an extensive scene in a more elaborate renderer for animation or other purposes.
But we can’t logically expect a render from Keyshot to resemble a render in another program, can we? Since Keyshot will read Zbrush materials as well as Zbrush does, if I understand the function of the bridge correctly…?
We’d still have to adjust the ZB maps, to suit the other program, right?
Am I missing some key element of the ZB/Keyshot combo?
Again, thank you for the response.
It wasn’t my intention to argue either. Whether someone buys, doesn’t buy, it’s all the same to me. However there seems to be more hand-wringing about this product thant is really warranted. Most people are going to have a clear feeling about whether they will/won’t benefit from the Keyshot bundle, and the price it is being offered at doesn’t really warrant much concern over a prohibitive investment. If you have access to 5 render engines that you enjoy working in, and serve your needs in terms of output and setup time, then the Keyshot Bundle is likely to be a novelty for you.
However, even people with high end animation rendering tools benefit from using Keyshot as a rapid visualization and concept tool. Consider the ease and speed with which you can set up different looks for people to consider, before committing the set up time to one of those tools. Consider that the Zbrush specific Keyshot bundle adds an interactive render preview to the Zbrush workflow, which is a valuable feedback tool in some of those applications you mentioned. Consider that there might be tools you enjoy using more than others, even if their basic functionality is matched by others you already have.
The last I checked there was a trial version for Keyshot HD. People should be able to install that and get a pretty good idea of whether Keyshot as a renderer is a tool that offers them anything and that they would enjoy using, and then factor in the increased Zbrush interactivity that the Zbrush Keyshot Bundle will bring at an attractive introductory price. Then hopefully we can dispense with a bit of the uninformed speculation on the boards.
But we can’t logically expect a render from Keyshot to resemble a render in another program, can we? Since Keyshot will read Zbrush materials as well as Zbrush does, if I understand the function of the bridge correctly…?
Not entirely, no. Other tools will still rely on GoZ functionality or standard import functions.
But the setup time in Keyshot is minimal. It doesnt cost a lot of time and effort to monkey around with the look of something and get quality results. That’s rather the entire point of Keyshot. It’s designed to be an exploratory and visualization tool, to allow experimentation that would be prohibitive in something more cumbersome, and help you quickly choose between different looks and head into other tools with more deliberation.
If you don’t see the point of that, then Keyshot may very well not be necessary for you. Fair enough, move on and let other people for whom the Keyshot Bundle fills a significant gap in available options benefit.
To those of you who are wondering about whether the bridge would be useful. My workplace uses keyshot in a similar manner to what is indicated here with the bridge exporting from Creo, Solidworks and Rhino . Octane Render,V-Ray, Modo etc: are better renderers for final highly controlled artwork, but Keyshot is good enough for most package art. Luxion are the kings of usability and that makes a huge difference if you want to pump out concepts. Although I wish other renderers like Octane would have stepped up to make their own bridges, I will probably jump on the intro priced Keyshot with bridge for my home box.
It is not that Keyshot is faster as a rendering program, but Luxion considers the overall process beyond the raw processing power.Personally I find it frustrating- KS is NOT the best renderer- but it has the best workflow- so it is an industry standard for industrial design rendering. Out of the box KS can get you up and going much faster than programs like modo- their choices of HDRIs and material assignments, and post render workflow get you to an acceptable level out of the box.
For instance the Pro version of KS has a network queue. So even though Octane Render is faster- the fact that you can set up a few renders and walk away means that KS workflow is effectively as fast or faster than the Octane workflow. At the entry level, the advantages are not as numerous. If you are a hobbyist with access to other renderers- and you are not trying to hit deadlines, manual export might be the better option.
That’s a really good point, Parel. As these conversations inevitably devolve into tool X vs tool Y perceived value debates, people tend to gloss over usability as a meaningful factor. For one off projects, it doesnt matter if you have the fastest rendering performance in the world, if it takes twice as long to set up the results you want. Speed is measured in many different ways.
Keyshot does not replace a high end, fully featured animation rendering tool for those that require that. It doesn’t currently have the fine tuning capacity of convoluted shader tree set ups. But it does occupy a sweet spot where quality vs set up time/ performance, and usability all intersect in positive fashion, and that’s why it’s good. The Keyshot for Zbrush bundle looks to further occupy a sweet spot for pricing and zbrush interactivity for many Zbrush users. It is a good fit for a tool like Zbrush, which is increasingly about experimentation and rapid visualization.
Nothing is perfect. No tool does everything exactly how you want. But Zbrush has always been about providing options, and different ways to get to the same place. The Keyshot Bundle is another great expansion in options available to Zbrush users.
Download the demo, make your own decisions. I personally believe the value speaks for itself, but either way there’s nothing to fret over in any of this.
No, definitely nothing to fret over. It all seems to be geared to the positive.
Thank you for your insight, parel. It’s exactly what I was hoping to get…some descriptions of
how Keyshot might be utilized.
One reason I’m asking “How can I use KS?” is…I tried to make maps designed for Render Program X fit Render Program Y, and almost pulled my self bald-headed, before throwing up my hands and saying “Enough. I’m going back to the straight specularity maps.” (I was trying to bring the joy of metalness to Poser.)
Anyway, thank you both for your responses.
And just a note…I’m still using the traditional shader tree in Modo, as of this writing. 
I have yet to master Modo’s node-based system, although in theory, it ought to be more my thing than the shader tree, since Poser has used a node-based material system for some time now.
Again, thank you both for taking the time to respond.
We all approach things from our own experiences and viewpoints.
One thing I would like to repeat from another post
Have had KeyShot for about two years starting with version 4 (and had their zbrush beta)
To me, this program (KS) awakened all that I liked about this type of work
I am a HDRI groupie, if the choice and means were there in a program I incorporated
it into any scene I could. Because its results were sometime unpredicatable and the render times
were quite long, sometimes there was frustration.
But the final results were always worth the aggravation.
This unpredictability and long render times were erased thanks to KS.
A blanket statement: if you like HDRI lighting and its results buy KS.
If you do not like it or are unsure of what it is don’t.
Bad place to say this but given a choice between Zbrush and KeyShot, I pick KeyShot and don’t look back.
Now,fortunately, I don’t have to.
Luck.
I love HDRI backgrounds.
I don’t know a whole lot about creating them, but they surely make super reflections on metals.
Bad place to say this but given a choice between Zbrush and KeyShot, I pick KeyShot and don’t look back.
Oh, no, you didn’t.
I don’t think I could choose between Zbrush and Modo!
I use the two programs together, and I would NOT want to give up either one.
Thanks for the info about KS.
I wish we had a more priciest release date…
But we can’t logically expect a render from Keyshot to resemble a render in another program, can we? Since Keyshot will read Zbrush materials as well as Zbrush does, if I understand the function of the bridge correctly…?
We’d still have to adjust the ZB maps, to suit the other program, right?
Am I missing some key element of the ZB/Keyshot combo?
Again, thank you for the response.
I Thought z brush was trying to become a all in one package. I feel key shot takes away from this all in one idea. I do understand its a choice and many people in this thread feel pixologic can do no wrong and their eyes, but I feel this choice takes away from zbrush users that were only trying to stay in z brush. maybe they those this path to make money off of keyshot.
people who only use z brush (mostly concept artist), might understand where I am coming from
Surely the ZB render engine will continue to be updated, as well as the other components of ZB?
If not, is Keyshot going to gradually supplant it?
If so, I’m going to be awfully sorry if I don’t jump on the bridge package.
And that is why I asked if I was missing some element of the ZB/Keyshot combination. Is KS going to be a must
have, at some point, if we want to render straight from ZB?
Speculation can lead one to some wild thoughts.
Artists love a great all-in-one solution either because they don’t have to switch software or because they don’t have to purchase another package to get a job done, or both. Sadly, it doesn’t usually work out that way. I, and I think most would like a software that plays to its strengths and delegates other packages to handle its weaknesses. Pixologic has built a bridge to make a seamless transition into another package, and negotiated the cost of this package down for their clients, I find it hard to expect more from them. At the end of the day we can be sad that Pixologic didn’t build their own PBR for Zbrush instead, but that won’t do any good.
Utter nonsense. You have an agenda of negativity, and you’re trying too hard.
Like I said before, the Keyshot Bundle is icing on the cake for those who stand to benefit from it. The meat of the ZBr7 update are a number of what appear to be the most significant updates to the program in some time. The move to 64 bit by itself is game changing, and the program appears to boast a number of highly significant advances, some of which users have wanted for a decade. If you really believe Pixologic’s goal is to make Zbrush an “all in 1” application, which I personally doubt but only Pixologic can say for certain what their goals are, then those program updates are working towards that goal.
Oh, and like every previous update for the past decade, this one will be free to registered users. Because Pixologic is of course a money grubbing corporation, who make a habbit of never having previously charged for massive program updates, and decided to provide an affordable professional grade render option at a fraction of the cost of the normal commercial package to keep it accessible for hobbyists, because obviously squeezing every dime they can from their customer base has always been apparent in their business model. 
Never mind the fact that many of those “all in one” industry standard tools became all in ones by incorporating and assimilating a third party render engine like Mental Ray, because sometimes it is just more practical to partner than to split development in an area where other people clearly excel. Never mind that the most widely used and highly regarded rendering engines are almost all third party solutions designed to work with other content creation tools through application-specific packages.
The simple beauty of the Keyshot Bundle is that YOU. DON’T. HAVE. TO. USE. IT. If you decide it doesn’t work for your output needs, or doesn’t offer you anything, or you dont like the name, or the price, or the color of the box, YOU. DON’T. HAVE. TO. BUY. IT. Nothing changes for you. You still get a massively improved Zbrush, for free, and are free to render using whatever tools you wish.
If you honestly believe the choice was between partnering with an established rendering tool, or making Zbrush a full featured render natively this year, then you’re being either hopelessly naive or being willfully obtuse, and you dont really understand the extent of the challenge there. The road to making Zbrush a fully featured ray trace modeler with complex shadows, real SSS, real caustics, emissive surfaces, real GI, etc is a long one. So they leapfrogged years of Zbrush development, to provide this OPTION to users right now. They provide it on top of the free, massive update to the programs capability.
Whether it makes more sense for Zbrush to continue to develop natively in this regard, or to partner with and assimilate third party solutions to a greater extent is a decision for people much more intelligent and informed than you or I. Either way, it will cost money to get that access to those rendering tools. Or does anyone believe that a Zbrush with a native rendering ability that rivals those found in other much more expensive high end tools, would not be a significantly more expensive Zbrush? The nice thing about the third party option is that it let’s you choose where and how to spend that money for quality rendering, for whatever best meets your needs.
If you get nothing else through your head, understand that this was in no way a choice between “Better rendering with Keyshot”, or “Better Rendering in Zbrush” now or in the future. Zbrush isn’t close to that kind of rendering ability. It’s a matter of “Can we provide this option for our users right now”.
Utter nonsense. You have an agenda of negativity, and you’re trying too hard.
Like I said before, the Keyshot Bundle is icing on the cake for those who stand to benefit from it. The meat of the ZBr7 update are a number of what appear to be the most significant updates to the program in some time. The move to 64 bit by itself is game changing, and the program appears to boast a number of highly significant advances, some of which users have wanted for a decade. If you really believe Pixologic’s goal is to make Zbrush an “all in 1” application, which I personally doubt but only Pixologic can say for certain what their goals are, then those program updates are working towards that goal.
Oh, and like every previous update for the past decade, this one will be free to registered users. Because Pixologic is of course a money grubbing corporation, who make a habbit of never having previously charged for massive program updates, and decided to provide an affordable professional grade render option at a fraction of the cost of the normal commercial package to keep it accessible to hobbyists, because obviously squeezing every dime they can from their customer base has always been apparent in their business model.
Never mind the fact that many of those “all in one” industry standard tools became all in ones by incorporating and assimilating a third party render engine like Mental Ray, because sometimes it is just more practical to partner than to split development in an area where other people clearly excel. Never mind that the most widely used and highly regarded rendering engines are almost all third party solutions designed to work with other content creation tools through application-specific packages.
The simple beauty of the Keyshot Bundle is that YOU. DON’T. HAVE. TO. USE. IT. If you decide it doesn’t work for your output needs, or doesn’t offer you anything, or you dont like the name, or the price, or the color of the box, YOU. DON’T. HAVE. TO. BUY. IT. Nothing changes for you. You still get a massively improved Zbrush, for free, and are free to render using whatever tools you wish.
If you honestly believe the choice was between partnering with an established rendering tool, or making Zbrush a full featured render natively this year, then you’re being either hopelessly naive or being willfully obtuse, and you dont really understand the extent of the challenge there. Pixologic faced a truth that the road to making Zbrush a fully featured ray trace modeler with complex shadows, real SSS, real caustics, emissive surfaces, real GI, etc was a long one. So they leapfrogged years of Zbrush development, to provide this OPTION to users right now. They provide it on top of the free, massive update to the programs capability.
Whether it makes more sense for Zbrush to continue to develop natively in this regard, or to partner with and assimilate third party solutions to a greater extent is a decision for people much more intelligent and informed than you or I. Either way, it will cost money to get that access to those rendering tools. Or does anyone believe that a Zbrush with a native rendering ability that rivals those found in other much more expensive high end tools, would not be a significantly more expensive Zbrush? The nice thing about the third party option is that it let’s you choose where and how to spend that money for quality rendering, for whatever best meets your needs.
If you get nothing else through your head, understand that this was in no way a choice between “Better rendering with Keyshot”, or “Better Rendering in Zbrush” now or in the future. Zbrush isn’t close to that kind of rendering ability. It’s a matter of “Can we provide this option for our users right now”.
stop being so dramatic, we all have our own opinions
I wasn’t addressing your right to have an opinion. I was addressing your poorly made, nonsensical argument and baseless accusation. Stop making those, and I have no problem with whatever you chose to like or not like.
Pixologic has built a bridge to make a seamless transition into another package, and negotiated the cost of this package down for their clients, I find it hard to expect more from them. At the end of the day we can be sad that Pixologic didn’t build their own PBR for Zbrush instead, but that won’t do any good.
Now, that makes sense.
Giving ZB users access to a PBR render program that reads ZB materials is a gift to ZBrushers.
I fought to make a “traditional” render engine accept PBR maps…and it is not an easy feat to accomplish.
I wasn’t thinking about PBR when I posted my original question…should have been though, because PBR seems
to be the trend in 3D graphics now. And I love PBR materials.
Thanks, zcomb.
Edit: I’m hoping to see PBR incorporated into programs like Poser and DS before long. If that happens, Keyshot will be very useful as a preview render tool for me.
I wasn’t addressing your right to have an opinion. I was addressing your poorly made, nonsensical argument and baseless accusation. Stop making those, and I have no problem with whatever you chose to like or not like.
that’s your opinion, now stop being over dramatic…also stop making it sound like you are stating facts
Stop trying to make it sound like I’m doing something that I’m in no way doing, in order to make it sound like you have any sort of point whatsoever?
See, I can spout nonsense too. It’s lots of fun. I can see why you do it so often.
You made an argument. I made an argument. People are capable of reading each and deciding which has more merit for themselves. It’s understood by everyone that arguments made on the internet are based on opinion, because people aren’t idiots. However sometimes people with weak arguments get their nose bent out of shape when someone calls them on it, and instead try to carry on as if someone is in some way suppressing their right to an opinion.
The right to express an opinion does not equal the right to have that opinion go unchallenged, especially if it’s baseless and insulting. Carrying on as if it does suggests you dont have any real argument to make to support your opinion.
Stop trying to make it sound like I’m doing something that I’m in no way doing, in order to make it sound like you have any sort of point whatsoever?
See, I can spout nonsense too. It’s lots of fun. I can see why you do it so often.
You made an argument. I made an argument. People are capable of reading each and deciding which has more merit for themselves. It’s understood by everyone that arguments made on the internet are based on opinion, because people aren’t idiots. However sometimes people with weak arguments get their nose bent out of shape when someone calls them on it, and instead try to carry on as if someone is in some way suppressing their right to an opinion.
The right to express an opinion does not equal the right to have that opinion go unchallenged, especially if it’s baseless and insulting. Carrying on as if it does suggests you dont have any real argument to make to support your opinion.
you are the one arguing and smearing people…I don’t know you and want pretend to know you. I have know Idea what you are talking about by saying I do this often…you are starting to creep me out