Diary of a VSWIP (Very Slow Work in Progress)

[elarcano]

Ok, first things first,

I’m still new to zbrush, in fact I’m new to all the 3D world… -heck- ZB is the first 3D/2.5D program that I’ve ever used.

The main goal on this thread is to show the development of a model from the point of view of somebody that doesn’t know squat about 3D. For new users I think it will be a relief to see someone who knows less than them and for more advance users… well, to review some basic mistakes made in the process -and there shall be a LOT of mistakes-

Since there is sooooo much I have yet to learn, I’ll try to do so on the way, from the basic zsphere structure to a fully painted model.

-Warning-
This is NOT a tutorial nor the “good” way of doing things right, just a diary of a VSWIP made from someone who has no remorse in showing his 3D clumsyness

With that said… off I go:

Character: Ezequiel

Ok, I started with a basic zsphere structure, very simple… in fact… Too simple after knowing that a good zsphere structure will help you a lot to get things done ahead in the mesh’s form

Well… more to come

Any critics, comments, feedback or corrections to my nonesense are very welcome

PS.

Just in case you missed Jason’s thread you can find it here / highly recommended

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[Prayer]

good luck man !

[Jason_Belec]

Well it’s looking good so far.

[elarcano]

Thanks guys. Kind words from kind people

Ok, here we go again,

First of all… hmmmmm, remember I recommended you to press Store Morph before doing any modeling when using a zsphere structure?.. well, the best way to learn that is to not do it and later on making you life a living hell when you try to repose the model within Zbrush… well… I forgot doing so -OH THE TRAGEDY
as far as I know, pressing Store Morph with the preview off helps you when you want to repose your model in zbrush by tweaking you zsphere structure and if you know how to do it “right” you have a lot of reposing possibilities without exporting your model to another 3D program.

So ok, I made a BIG Zsphere mistake -Sorry Jason-… knowing that, I went on with my life and made an Adaptive skin… and then did some basic anatomy remodeling.

I really prefer to go from general to particular -an old art school habit -… and that I’m veeeeeery slow :rolleyes:

[womball]

I think that’s a very good workflow. General to specific, that way you can get your proportions right before adding details.

[Jason_Belec]

I agree with womball. Then you wouldn’t have forgotten a key step. That’s like an oil painter forgetting the canvas!

Pretty cool other than that.

Of course now you are learning old school - repetition, do it enough times and you will get it right.

[elarcano]

From general to particular, that’s a habit I acquired in art school. It’s important for getting the “Big picture”, because you could make some fine details and the rest is still to be defined but the problem with this is that you could spend a lot of time in the fine details and not necesarily look good when you finish later on the rest.
In painting it’s called painting by layer -sorry, it’s not a technical name - First you start with a washy kinda first layer -so the paint impregnates the fibers of the canvas- and then you go on by layers and in each layer you add more more details but as a whole… ok… I’ve gone to far with this method thing

Thanks for sticking around guys, much appreciated

[elarcano]

Almost a week from the last post with images! And you’re suppose to get “quicker” as you get used to the program!
Man, am I sloooow or what?!!!

Well, here are some improvements -if they qualify as that-
Just some anatomy tweaking -I’m pretty happy with the proportions so I’m going foward for the details-

Yep! That’s all folks

-Any tips or comments are as always, very welcome-

-That’s what took you all week?- My relentless concience

-SHUT UP!-

-Your gaining some weight and smoking way too much- My relentless concience

-Where’s my antipsicotic pill?-

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[Santis]

Omg, thats one of the coolest monsters i have ever seen!

[Jason_Belec]

Really nice work Fidel! This is going to be a cool monster! I do hope you went back and made him poseable!! For a guy in the corner you sure do learn fast.

[wenna]

This is very cool! I like the idea of this thread… maybe I might be able to follow along! Thanks again for writing out your procedures and even the mistakes, that way we all can (maybe) avoid them.

wenna

[Santis]

For how long have you ben into ZBrush?

[elarcano]

Oh Dear Diary,
Today I feel that I love Katty even more than yesterday, because evertime I think of her, I feel like I can fly high into the… OH! Sorry,wrong Diary

Hey guys! Thanks A LOT for the kind words!
This is the first time I get to “answer” somethings one by one… that’s pretty cool!

Santis:

Omg, thats one of the coolest monsters i have ever seen!
Wow! It amazing that you like the “little fella” SO muc… wait a minute… mom? Is that you?!!!

No really Santis, Wow! pretty strong words, thanks! But I must STRONGLY recommend you to look around the community. The are sooooooo many awesome artist who really know what their doing and that are tremendously gifted. Just to mention a few: alexleia, sebcesoir, BlackNull, madmac, kissb, boozy floozie, asims, carlos_sr, joe_seig, metamesh and my very favorite Jedi Zmaster Jason Belec -who I like to refer as my friend… or the guy who just tolerates me

For how long have you ben into ZBrush?
Well, I would have like to spend 2 years working on something really cool before posting it and then saying that I just had ZB for 2 weeks… but I think I blew that opportunity
I think I’ve had ZB since February, so thats makes… -where’s my calculator?-… 3 months now -and really enjoying it- But to be honest I have to say that I’ve had a 5 year formal Fine Art studies… that and that I’m unemploid… so I got TONS of time on my hands now!

Jason:Thanks man! -means a lot to me

[color=#d0d0d0]I do hope you went back and made him poseable!!
I guess this is the part that I could say that my dog ate my zsphere tools?
Unfortunately I didn’t went back, just foward with the experiment to see the other “option” -adaptive skin-
But I’ll to come up with another guy with zspheres all the way. This is just one of several characters I intend to do… if I don’t dye or get a job at flipping burgers before
I went through with my zsphere mistake because I wanted to leave a straight record of what you can do when you mess up a very simple but basic rule -of course, I could’ve done the zsphere structure again, but didn’t- So don’t forget gang… Store Morph before any modeling or posing… and stay away from drugs -that was the Mr. T in me-
So yeah… I’ll have to use another 3D program to pose him

Wenna:
I’m very glad that this could help you or anyone… that’s the idea of the thread… and to meet someone who can avoid the possibility of me flipping burgers… I even burn water!

Man! This is getting long and looks more like an interview to a very bad unemploid comedian… so ok… I’ve tried to do some detailing but… AHA! -no, not the 80’s band- A posible mistake or something my little gray matter doesn’t understand and don’t know how to fix it!
Ezequiel has already 2568512 poligons but I don’t know if I’ve pushed to much the mesh from the original result of the zsphere structure -post 1/ pic 3- that when I try to do some fine details it just isn’t possible without the poligons showing in a very aweful way

I’ve tried dividing it as high as 7 millions -I think- as a test, but my computer will puke blood if I really work on that level… besides -yep! another question- What’s the max amount of poligons that I can migrate to another 3D program without losing all the fine details done at this division?

I hope these questions doesn’t send this thread to the “questions and troubleshooting…” basket

Thanks for the futher assistantship -really need it!-

Chau!

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[Santis]

“The are sooooooo many awesome artist who really know what their doing and that are tremendously gifted.”

Yes I know, they are really good. They can do cool and detailed monsters, but your monster looked sooo cool. Even if some of the other monsters are more advanced then yours, your designe was cooler, they are too classic. Like a Vampire, it can be detailed and stuff like that, but they already exist, I have never seen a monster like THAT before, and that impressed me.

[slocik]

7mln polys is way to much, dont worry about the polys looking taht way, it wont be wisible anyway when the whole model will be on the pic, you can turn off the quick 3d and in tool> display> turn on smooth ad set dsmooth 1 :]

[elarcano]

Santis:
Thanks again man!

Slocik:
Yeah, I imagine that 7 millions is way too much… but why? -Remember I know “squat” about 3D-

The other thing is that I’m planning to use these characters for animation -long way from now- as well as still images, so there could be a close up in the future… then what?
The gray image has the quick 3D Edit off and the DSmooth is already at 0.5 (post 13 / second image / left)

So the questions are still unanswered (post 13 / under the images)

Thanks ladies and gentlemen

[ilusiondigital]

Hey elarcano, great stuff, when i see the basic zsphere model i think… psssss. but each step is better, you are making a great character, it has character =)))

[abone114]

7 mil. polys is too much because it will bog down any normal system when it comes to render time let alone any kind of animation you might want to do with your character. a computers memory can only handle so much. an ideal area you want to focus on for a high resolution mesh is 100,000-500,000 at the very most to RENDER, you still could not animate at this poly count. you would have to use a target mesh and replace this mesh at rendertime. but there are tricks around this if you are using another 3d package to render, either maya, max or xsi. displacement maps are the most used way to go, if you want to do gaming models then normal maps are also great for this. i suggest you look up and research both typs of maps, there are LOTS of tutorials on this forum reguarding both kinds. im not an expert at all at either one yet or i would help you myself. good luck! and very nice work for your first 3d work, im impressed

[aminuts]

hi,

Well, it seems you have read well the forums and have picked up on the important notes supplied there in so…I really can’t add much to help ya other than to say…

Keep going…you are on the right track! Patience, and saving alot are your friends!

Haven’t posted in a long while and had to relog in so am not sure if my signature links are still there til I commit this reply but if they are…check out my worlds best links to PU’s and Scripts…best 2 hours of checking stuff out here you will spend…well maybe not the best 2 but definitely will save ya enuf time for more researching later.

ps…welcome to the nut house!

[elarcano]

Thanks Guys for your comments and for taking the time to post -really encouraging -

ilusiondigital:
I’ve heard the same comment about me before

abone114:
Yeah, I think I’ll go displacement maps -If I ever learn the full meaning of it -
If I’m not wrong -and probably I am- Displacement maps have height, depth and relief while Bump maps doesn’t affect the mesh’s relief… hmmmm… have to do more research about that

aminuts:
Wow! I’ve seen your links and it’ll be more like the best 2 years spent -I’m not that bright-
Yeah! Saving a lot as become my best new friend after ZB has chrashed some times on me after some hours of modeling … patience… well… I’m a visual artist who’s unemploid, so that’s like my breakfast every morning
Thanks for the welcome… The program as well as the community are adictive!

Ok, new problem or maybe not -what do I know-

I was working on the head and saved, but at the very end of saving the program crashed and I’m not sure if has something to do with it.

By the way, this is my PC specifications:

AMD Athlon 2.6+ XP Processor

Nvidia MSI GeForce FX 5200 128 Video card

1G of ram

And a pretty cool but old case

So if anyone could answer me that would be great

At this rate if I don’t post some improvements I’ll be kicked to the loooonely “questions and troubleshooting…” forum

PS:

Yes, I’ve tried Smart ReSym, ReSym and praying… but nothing… I’d really hate to have to go an earlier version So someone has to have an explaination and a possible solution -that goes for the lurkers as well-

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