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what's the BEST method of using normal maps in maya?

ZBrush Usage Questions
#1

hi there,

I’m really struggling with certain aspects of zbrush, and I’d really appreciate some help here, anyone, please. (And thanks in advance, by the way)

Ok. In Zbrush I have made a sculpt of a male head. I have created all the maps I need: Colour base, diffuse (Which includes AO & cavity in the mix), normal, specular and spec colour.

[](http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:zb_insimg%28%27105391%27,%27maya%201.JPG%27,1,0%29)

Ok. My questions:

  1. Has anyone successfully used the Headus Killeroo normal shader, and if so how do you get specularity in to the mix?

  2. Is Maya’s in-built normal map shader meant to be this poor, or am I doing something wrong?

  3. Is there an EFFICIENT, SIMPLE normals shader for Maya available somewhere that I can easily use, and get PROFESSIONAL results for in-game character creation?

  4. Can some of you guys on the forum please show me where to look for the tutorials that really helped you become the artists that you are today, especially if you’re in-game asset creators? please? i’m going nuts with stuff!

Thanks for you’re time :wink:

jase

#2

u

#3

hi there,

i’ve just become a new member of the forum. i posted new thread 18 hours ago, but no one’s responding. aurick? anyone?
am i doing things correctly?

my thread is called “what’s the best method of using normal maps in maya?”

i’m anxious for response, so i can move on

Thanks

TPMD

#4

I’m afraid I can’t help with Maya questions, since I’m not a Maya user. Since this is specifically a Maya question, you might want to check with some of the Maya forums. A normal map is a normal map. The fact that it was generated in ZBrush isn’t going to affect things.

#5

thanks Aurick!

#6

Have you tried using mental ray for rendering? If I am not mistaken version 7.0 of Maya had some issues with normal map rendering (although it could ve been mental ray in that version that had those…)

To get specularity showing on an object that’s shaded with a no-specularity-supported shader, you could probably get a mix 8 layer shader (or mix 20 - both could be found on highend3d, I believe) - which allows you to layer various shaders in a photoshop-like fashion. So you could have your base as that labert-like shader, and the top one could be a blin with 0 opacity - but with specularity, set to “screen” mode.

But to be honest, the best way for me (when i was rendering stuff in maya 7.0 - 8.5) was not to use normal maps at all and use bump maps instead. If you’re rendering a game character, it may be better to render it in some game engine you can get a hold of and not in maya altogether.

#7

This thread has a video with some information about rendering normal maps in Maya which may be of use:
http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=61676&page=4&pp=15

See earlier in the thread for the ZBrush side of things.

#8

hey marcus, thanks very much for that, i’ll take a look at this stuff in a second. hopefully it’ll have what i need :slight_smile: :+1:

hey fess, thankyou for this info. i havn’t heard of a mix 8 layer shader - i’ll look into it. and i’ve been thinking of upgrading maya to version 8 for a while, but didn’t know if it was worth the bother. maybe it is…
so what are saying? that you don’t think normal maps are all they’re hyped up to being? or are you refering to a time in your work when normal maps were quite new and generally bump mapping was the most popular choice?
i mean i can’t go to a job interview without showing that i can make and apply normal maps effectively, can i?
by the way…it’s an honour, sir. i’ve seen your work around for a while now. i really love “punk”. awsome!!

thanks both

jase :+1: :+1: :+1:

#9

Uhm, no - I was referring to the type of stuff that I was making, which wasn’t real-time game art. Back then I was only using normal maps to get the finest levels of detail, but I was getting “raytraced shadows + normal maps” related artifacts during rendering. I believe at the time software renderers weren’t on par with hardware ones, when it came to rendering normal maps.

But if you are making a real time game character, then hardware rendering (with normal maps) is your best choice imo. If only to say that thats how it looks real-time. And if you used a game engine, like unreal’s or crysis ones - it would also be something you could put on your resume.

Btw, thanks - glad you liked that character, he took a long time in the making.

#10

Hey Fess,

This sounds like very good advice (Not that i can tell who’s right or wrong yet!) but by the look of your work i’ll accept that you know your stuff.
i’m getting very frustrated and upset lately, i go on forums and ask nicely for help on the small details that i’m still not sure of, and i get messed around, no end. so thank you, it’s very much appreciated.

jase

#11

here is the crux of my problem…it’s self explanitory…

i’ve tried using an 8mix layer shader. doesn’t work, or at least i can’t get it to work. just get funny coloured image.
isn’t it possible to just detach the lambert and attach a phong somehow?

any ideas anyone?

btw, i know the texture maps don’t match the normal map!! ha ha!

thanks

j

#12

hi all

just so that nobody wastes their time, i’ve solved the issue. upgraded to maya 8.5. much more powerful that 7.0. it p***es all over normal mapping issues. my renders look awsome in comparison to yesterdays!

problem solved

thanks to all who helped

jase

#13

hi TPMD,

I’ve been struggling with similar issues over this past week, concerning getting normal maps to render nicely.
As with your situation, my normal mapped models look pretty decent in the work window with high quality setting on, but after rendering the quality is somehow lost.
I’ve tried rendering with and without mental ray and the results are pretty much the same. I’m using Maya 8.5. Do you have any suggestions or could you possibly point me in the right direction?
I feel so frustrated, I’ve spent 30+ hours in the last week watching and following tutorials online to get similarly poor results over and over. I’m tring normal maps generated in Zbrush 3.1 and Maya 8.5, but it seems to make no difference.

I’ll put up some screenshots showing my results in a bit, hope to hear from you thanks!

T

#14

hi talster,

sorry for not getting back sooner, didn’t notice this in my emails 'til now!
i really don’t know how to start answering this question, to be honest. as soon as i started using maya 8.5, the promlem i had; the same problem you are having now, corrected itself. my work started looking great, and since then, i’m nearly done with the final image. don’t despair, this stuff can be a nightmare, but the answers are just around the corner…somewhere!!
i’ll give you all the help i can, but first let me know if you’ve solved it already.

jase