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Subtool / TPose Problem

ZBrush Usage Questions
#1

I love using subtools and layers - they rock - thank you Pixelogic Team. With that said, I am having some very odd issues that I have not experienced in the past.

I have a 3ds Max file where I keep my base mesh and all of the subtools in one place - all placed on the character in the proper place and ready for export into ZBrush for sculpting.

They all worked properly with the occassional object being slightly out of place when it is imported - all accept for one pair of subtools - for some reason these two subtools are being shot off into space somewhere that I can not find them - not even with the “Frame” button.

They show up fine when I import them, but not when I append them to the main ZTool - or even when I reverse and append the ZTool to the new objects imported.

I have checked my settings, but as of yet have not located any setting that would cause this.

Also, sometimes when I import this object it is only visible on one side and dissappears when I turn it - very odd.

Any suggestions?

#2

Have you tried using SubTool Master to import them?

#3

Regarding seeing only side, this is a setting in Zbrush under Display Properties, check Double and you’ll see both sides. This is all relative to how your normals are set up. For instance if you have a single flat polygon, with a single normal, it’s projecting out in to space in one direction and Zbrush won’t display on screen the implied reverse of that normal projection until you check “Double” in Display Properties in the Tool menu.

#4

no luck with the subtools master imports, but I will continue to test and experiment - also I am unable to effectively use TPose mesh because it moves certain subtools each time I do it - not just once, but moves them up and left each time the same amount of space so - if I do it three times it moves those objects 3 times the space - I am going to try to “reset” combining the subtools and then separate them - unless that will loose all of my details - not sure how I will handle this one - very odd.

regarding the one side only - this is a whole object - with multiple sides - not a flat surface so I am unsure why it is acting up like this - will try restarting first - wish me luck:).

#5

I continue to have issues with this.

I am even willing to loose the 7 layers of detail (mutter/grumble/heh) if I must and start all that over, but after I joined the objects together and scaled it properly to “work around” the problem listed previously (the knife was the object that was not importing properly) I no longer have the ability to use anything other than the scale tool as you can see it is working properly. The move and rotate tools give the result shown (there is no masking in the scene).

Any ideas?

ScaleMoveRotate_001.jpg
ScaleMoveRotate_001.jpg1725×516 498 KB

#6

Heya, if the object is displaying oddly still and your’e sure your normals are proper, then maybe you have overlapping UVs in spots causing that to mess up the display, try to import that object without UV’s and take a look at it, maybe make new ones with UVMaster directly in Zbrush. Best of luck.

Regarding the issue with Transpose Master, I’ve never been able to use that plugin successfully so I can’t help you there, I get the same thing alot of times to the point where I don’t even bother with it and just pose things manually, one subtool at a time. I think it’s very touchy about the model being built up perfectly and with the way I model, well it’s not perfect so I don’t get great results with that plugin.

#7

Originally I had UVs on this guy, but after sitting in on the user meeting in Dallas last month I decided to delete my UVs and recreate them after I finish the sculpt based on the suggestions that Paul with Pixologic made (great stuff learned in that meeting BTW) so there are no UVs.

I know where things went wrong wtih this model, but what I don’t know is how to strip out all the bad info and “reset” the model so I can start over with the detailing from here.

I have already given up on being able to salvage the hours of details already competed, I really just want to reset it all and move forward.

Will try exporting and reimporting everything as an OBJ from here and post my results - seems that would reset it all /shrug we will see - frustrating, but great learning experience:).

#8

Ok - I believe I have isolated the files as NOT being the problem. I don’t see how it can be. I took the entire mesh as an OBJ and took it back into Max and ensured that ALL subtools had a “zeroed” out axis at 0-0-0 then followed these steps:

  1. Imported it into zbrush as a single OBJ
  2. Turned on Wireframe and did a group split
  3. Used TPose to combined all newly made subtools
  4. used TPose to separate all subtools back - here is where the problem arises - as you can see there are trools missing completely from the view - they are still in the side subtool panel, but they are not showing anywhere on the screen - I have even tried to find them using the “frame” button - no luck

What further makes me believe it is not the file is that I have done this three times and each time I got a slightly different result - always items missing, but not always the same items.

Any clues?

TPoseProblem_001.jpg
TPoseProblem_001.jpg1340×1002 497 KB

#9

Well, the more I test the more I think it IS the file for some reason so I am doing further testing to see how I can fix it - still clueless …

#10

Well, as the great philosopher once said …

“I might not always be right … but I am never wrong” heh

As is normally the case, at the end of a frustrating and dispair filled session and after one has had a chance to sleep on it, there is a valuable lesson to be learned, LoL.

I dove back into the problem this morning with a fresh set of eyes and thought I must have done something wrong in the way I exported the objects from Max.

It worked PERFECTLY this time and I did ONE small thing different …

Previously, I had the objects “grouped” inside of Max when I had exported them, this time I ungrouped them and merely “selected” all objects when I did the “export selected”.

As normal, a computer is the dumbest thing (it can only read 1’s and 0’s afterall) and it can’t read your mind so if the program was coded to do something different with grouped objects than selected objects it was just doing what it was told:).

Yet another valuable lesson learned /sigh … back to work …

#11

Still no clue as to the first problem with the move and rotate tools, but since my export / import seems to have fixed those issues, we will just pretend that never happened:).

Still having an ongoing issue with scaled items making other items dissappear and the frame button does not seem to get them back once they go - any ideas?

#12

Here is the problem in short with the scaling:

  1. There are two tools - one correct size - one extremely smaller - other than that they are basically identical
  2. I can see both of them individually, but once I append one to the other they both dissappear and never come back

I am attempting to scale one to meet the other one so I can do projections so I can re-acquire my details from the smaller one to the one that is correct size. I have done this many times, but this time (probably due to the extreme difference in size) I am having the current issue.

I will do further experimentation and can probably find a work around for this issue, but the dissappearing act is something there is likely a way to fix - any ideas?

#13

Well, as of yet have not figured out the issue with the dissappearing act, but did find a work around - I guessed at how much I needed to scale up the smaller object and scaled it as much as I thought it needed to be scaled to be visible in the other tool then appended it - moving ahead.

#14

Kind of a one-sided conversation in here huh? :smiley:
Well at any rate, thanks for posting your trouble shooting progress. Its good to know incase I run into the same issue.

#15

True about the one sided, but I can’t sit around and wait for someone else to figure it out, heh.

Hope it can ease someone else’s frustration if they encounter the same issues.

Not sure why yet, but when I scaled up the original object it lost all of its details so projection is a waste - moving ahead - at some point I just have to redo the details and forget the past - deadlines don’t move - this might be a private project, but I have other deadlines a’looming:).

Will try one last test to see if I can get the details - will redo the scale process at the highest level of subdivision - will be slow since it is around 10m polys, but I think that will work - we shall see.

#16

Ok - wrapping up this thread -

Note to self: when scaling a ZTool always do so at the highest subdivision level to ensure no loss of details.

Ok - NOW I am moving ahead - :rolleyes: