ZBrushCentral

question about zbrush and modo

Community
#21

Modeling rendering and animating are rather strong. So you can create rather large scenes. I was playing with it and as it happened I ended up having 6Mio Poly’s inthe scene. THAT is a lot. Max blows up with that amount but I don;t knwo what Maya does… Translate that into architectural dimensions and you have literally thousands of houses in the scene or hundreds of creatures… If you have the middle package then you also have the compositing app enabled and then rendering different passes to create those really stunning image results is as simple as 1 2 3. Define those pathes, plop them together in a tree like fashion, press a button and all is rendered and put together into the final image. You can tweak the compositinig tree in a gazillion ways while adding lens flare (or not 8-)) and glow and motion blur etc. etc… And of course… all is animatable and motion picture based. Quite a lot of stuff you get. Already with the entry package!.

And riging a character is as easy as importing your ZBrush Character, drawing a sceleton into it (pretty much like the ZBrush 2.5 demo shows with ZSpheres) and then press a ‘Envelope’ button and tatdaaaaa instant bendy creature. When the seams don;t fit. Open a weight paint window and smooth the influence between the bones simply with a brush.

And if you press an ‘auto’ button while bending your creature… you got your frist animation.

AND allthe operations STAY alive in a non linear operator stack. So you can go back to the first modifications of your character even when he’s all rigged up. You do not have to delete animatins and everything just to make the nose bigger. OR even add another nose…

TO master all the functions will take some time. But I started only using the modeling bit and then slowly gyrated into the other realms. That was supported nicely due to the fact that there are buttons you press for ‘Modeling’ or ‘Rendering’ or ‘Animation’ or’Simulation’ etc… which change the desktop slightly to optimize access to the special funtions unique to the task at hand. So when I am in modeling mode no rendering specific stuff is cluttering my workspace. However, I can still reach all that through sub menues OR simply pressing the Render mode button. Buttons are 1-5.

Give it a try when you can afford a couple of hours. It’s neat.
Lemo

#22

:smiley: Me,

I cannot find anything beating the much loved Zbrush 2.
Modo? I did try it.

Never.

For my purposes Zbrush is superior in any direction.
It permits to introduce structure into the structure, performing beautifully in building complex meshes, very suitable for human anatomy and biology.
Zbrush building balls are marvelous.
The interface is intuitively comfortable and functional. And much easier for a rank and file.

Zbrush Central is yet another amazing support.

Thanks dear all creators, helpers and participants.

Anatom

#23

I just wanted everone to know that wings3d has help me uvmap my models made in amorphium 3 perfectly. It even helped me add material to them. This is something A3 lacks in ability. Now I can take them into deep paint and paint away.

I like the way wings does this so much I intead on giving it some time to learn and get rid of uvmapper classic off my computer and let 3D Canvas hide itself from my start programs menu again.

Thanks for pointing me to wings.

AS for modo I downloaded the demo to take a look at it. Thats about it. Will probably still by Zbrush as my reward program for when I feel my skill levels have grown above “NEWBIE”!

#24

Yeah, one of these days.

One of the reasons I bought zb (a year ago?) was because of what they showed off on the 2.5 vids with teh rigging (more than a year ago). Of course so far it’s nothing more than vaporware, but hey, they got my $ already so what the hell.

Hey gottsbet, wings is hands down the best program to learn polymodeeling with. It’s uncluttered, free, and there’s lots of tutorials and such on the 'net amined at beginners that use wings.

#25

I agree. Wings is the best entry. THEN if you think you have to be fancy, go buy Silo for 100$. www.nevercenter.com. Check out their forum. In the news section are some REALY interesting videos regarding the upcoming version.

Lemo

#26

How about Maya? Doesn’t it has something like 3d sculpting in the polygon mode?

#27

Don’t know Maya that well but all the large animation and multifunction packages are not having a good time when you have a lot of poly’s. So… even if you have cool sculpting tools… Nothing matches up with ZBrush. Even XSI with it’s Gigapolgon core is getting rather slow by comparison to ZBrush. It can load the stuff but then… zzzzzZZZZZZzzzzzZZZZZzzzzz.
Actually, Wings, Silo, and Modo are also going flat quickly once confronted with a large number of poly’s. ZBrush rules for sculpting!
Lemo

#28

…add a modeling prog (because it’s french conceptors :wink:
Hexagon :eek:
Very powerful modeler! (like Silo but a little more strong) :rolleyes:
Pilou

#29

yes, zbrush rules in polygon count. no doubt.

Silo does better than wings3d, which is one of the reasons I moved from wings to silo.

I can’t speak for the others.

#30

I got Amorphium 3 $140.00
3D Canvas Pro $75.00
Deep Paint 3D paid $100.00 for

Thats $315.00

If you include the Wacom Intus 3 $200.00
My upgarde to Paint Shop Pro 9 $55.00 Thats $570.00.

with Wings3D, Blender (as long as the still make pain killers) I think I have enough to tinker with and learn how to model.

My next buy is going to be the stop goofing around program ZBRUSH!

No where on the web do I see art as good as I do here!
To go with Modo or Silo and put more money into this hobby and still not have Zbrush would be a poor choice. It is my next buy and if you havn’t bought it yet you should.

Now that my endorsement has been posted, Pixologic how about sending me a free copy of Zbrush! :lol:

#31

I agree fully! Good Choices! And a good job figuring all that out.
But if you want a free ZB copy… then go and check out the competition! Not many taking part and there’s a real chance you can win one!

http://www.laborganika.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=116

Lemo

#32

Z brush is a different app from all other modelers out there.
Nothing beats ZB in terms of organic modelling, and texturing is very good as well, even if you can’t do it directly in the 3d viewport.
Modo, and every other modeler out there , is what I’d call traditional modelling tools, in the sense you literally build up meshes with polygons, or also splines one exception popping out in these days is hexagon that , from the movies seems to have good sculpting capabilities AND traditional modelling toolset a la Modo, Silo.

Regarding ;Modo. It can seem similar to Zbrush, but its mainly because of its UI design and colors (but hexagon has them too LOL ). its however a traditional modeler, focused into subdivision surface modelling, good for inorganics and organic (traditional)modelling. 201 looks very promising, because it will introduce painting tools (directly in viewport) for all kind of traditinal texturing : color maps, diffuse, bump and other classic maps, plus displacement map painting and also baking mapa and normal maps, but NO powerful clay -like sculpt tools you can find in z brush. maybe they'll add this features in the future, as Hexagon developers seems to have done now. however, so far, it is a traditional modeler. but don't undervalue the goodness of traditional modelers. how you may know, they allow to model organics with less polygons, and allow to build app meshes ready for animation, with the right topology, especially important when it comes for facial animation . Its a thing you cannot do in ZB so far, because you should be allowed to reconstruct your mesh only in ZB 2.5, when its out. that's why many animators build up their meshes in diffeernt apps, import them in ZB and then sculpt the hell out of them, and texture them in ZB too. then reimport maps, and apply disp map and normal in their low res model, to obtain all the details, maps and more and be ready to animate their characters. whatever app /modeler you will use, this is very important to know so far. another important thing is that modelers like silo, hexagon, modo, are standalone modelers. apps like XSI, Lw ;Maya are complete packages, and with ZB and one of them you can make wonderful works and animations.
#33

ZBrush is great for doing high detail work on existing meshes or making quick “drafts” of ideas by adjusting existing meshes but I hate it for actually making a model. Im sure there are people out there who prefer the “scultural” feel of zbrush but Im not one of them.

What seperates ZBrush from programs like Lightwave, Maya, Max, Softimage… is that it is closer to a paint program in feel. Think Photoshop on steroids. The others are polygonal pased modeling systems, where you work with vertices, polygons and a completely different workflow. The best option is to get both. I personally use Lightwave or Modo to do the low to med res models, then take them into zbrush for detailing, then out into Softimage for rendering.

What you really need to do is get as many 3D app trials as you can. They kind of fit into groups workflow wise. I think that Maya and max are very similar in that they are iconic based gui’s which tend to try to be more user friendly (these drive me nuts). Softimage, Lightwave, and Modo are text based gui’s, so they are much cleaner interfaces. You also need to take into account the program styles. Lightwave has two seperate progams, so the modeling tools and animating tools are seperate. Max, Maya, and Softimage are an all in one. Modo is just modeling (until 201 comes out). So your best bet is to try these different programs, figure out how you like to work and take into account what you intend to use the software for. Some are better for photo real rendering, some for animating, others for modeling. Figure out what you want then team your modeling application up with Zbrush to add detail.

I hope that helps you. Another key thing to take into account is that if you are a student you get huge discounts. If your not sign up somewhere, get a student ID and then buy your software. For instance Modo is $99 (if you have a 3.0 gpa or better) instead of, what is it, $700. The other major apps can be bought for huge discounts at stores like www.academicsuperstore.com. Last I checked you could get a fully functional seat with any of the big 4 for under $300. You can even get zbrush at these places :).

Yeah so play around before you lay down the cash. There is a ton of variety out there and it can be a bit overwhelming to try and figure all of them out at first.

I cant even remember what this post was about. lol. Been typing so long. Hope this is what the topic was :slight_smile:

#34

I think programs like ZBrush are more meaningful than just tools. Ofer’s ZBrush is the smartest of all in its assumptions, concepts, values, and practices that are gesturally more elegant than the other programs that have copied, speculated or gyrated themselves in a small minded race to the canopy. Z’s just getting started. It’s not poison. The orange and grey immitations like Modo seem to me to be exactly that.

If you can invest yourself in any thing, let it be ZB.

#35

I have used Modo 103 and it is AWFUL! :td: Zbrush is superior in every way.

In terms of compositing/rendering, I only have experience in 3ds Max which did the job pretty well. I just got XSI though, I hope it is as good as Lemonnado said it was! The interface is already killing me, as I migrated from 3ds Max…

The main reason I wanted to move to XSI was because of its good ZBrush support! After several weeks, I still have not gotten displacement maps to work satisfactorily in 3ds Max, and as soon as I heard about XSI’s ZBrush specific importing tools, I knew I had to get it =]

#36

Hey everybody,

I will probably be hated for this because I’m on a ZBrush forum but here goes :).

ZBrush is a great program. It does things that the others cant even come close to. The whole feel of ZBrush is much more creative. If you like to work with clay or draw your characters/models out than you will love the way ZBrush feels. However, ZBrush is not better than the others at everything. If you want to build a hardbody model, say a car, ZBrush cant do that. If you want to really get down into the model and make adjustments at the vertice level, ZBrush cant do that. If you want to animate your character effectively, it doesn’t have the right tools.

Another consideration is if you are planning to make this a career. ZBrush is definately a great program to know since it is so powerful but it shouldn’t be the only program in your toolset. If you are going to pursue a 3D modeling career than you need to know at least one of the major packages (Maya, Max, Lightwave, XSI). Without that you are really limiting your potential. Another problem with starting in ZBrush is that you really cant learn the fundamentals of 3D from it.

I love this program, dont get me wrong, but if you are just starting out learn something else first. Learn a traditional modeling program. Learn to render, light, texture, UV map. At least get comfortable with the process of each of these steps. If you understand them than you can really use ZBrush to its full potential.

#37

Luxology has a demo video out in their announcement section on their web site. And that video shows how easy it is to render ZB Displacement Maps in Modo. Looks really good in the movie.
Lemo

PS:Monstermaker is already playing with Modo 201… So it can’t be long till they release it when they bother celebrities with it hahaha.

#38

Modo is very ambitious… but when I gave it a test drive I found it was far too buggy and jerky. Of COURSE ZBrush shouldn’t be the only part of your pipeline (unless you are a hobbyist/illustrator), but it does such a large chunk of the modelling work for you, that it is almost essential nowadays.

As for me, I have learnt all the “traditional” 3d application stuff, except modelling. The manual labor that is non ZB modelling put me off so much I didn’t even bother trying to learn it. I instead learnt the other aspects of 3d art instead. And now ZB is around, I can use that to model and combine my other 3d knowledge together =]. The only snag I’ve hit in this method is getting good edge loops… Guess I have to learn to model a base mesh the traditional way in this case…:lol:

I’ve found XSI to sound the most impressive app to use in conjunction with ZB so far. Here’s hoping the hype is true.:slight_smile: