ZBrushCentral

is Zbrush just for adding detail to a character?

Hi everyone.

Zbrush is a very popular software, but i actually never knew exactly
how it works, until i discover a video on the web that shows in 40 minutes
the making of a head from scratch, i was amazed by the power of ZBRUSH, is so friendly that is just like using virtual clay. Besides all the topology, the
mesh and polygonos align just like magic, YOU OBTAIN A VERY CLEAN MESH JUST IN SECONDS.

Well, i was wondering that i always see that artists do the whole model in
MAYA, MAX, ETC and then they use ZBRUSH just to add detail…If zbrush is so friendly and powerful why don`t use it since the begining to the end?

THANKS FOR YOUR TIME

Old Dogs and New Tricks most likley.

I stick with maya and/or modo for the roughing out… I feel I have greater control of the jestural form this way, then I got nuts with the brush style. Lots of folks are using Zspheres and such to go 0-infinty in Zbrush, just alot of us have been modeling for years and have certain prefs and habbits that at this point Zbrush does not accomodate.

My biggest issues with Z (as a begining point) are lack of topological control, and multiple objets… using another package as a start makes those 2 small issues null.

$0.02 oldDog.jpg

Thanks Obz for the answer, when you say that zbrush have “lack of topological control” is because the polygonos are generated in an automatic way?..i thought that automatic clean generated mesh was an advantage!!..PLEASE EXPLAIN THAT TO ME.

wonderful 3d model by the way!:wink:

ZBrush is used for modeling, illustration and texturing from start to finish all over the place. different users have different concerns so that will determine your eventual workflow.

So to answer your question directly, many artists do use it from start to finish.

Often on the forums you see people who are dealing with edgeloops in a pretty complicated way doing things like running edge loops around bicep muscles and things like that. This is a technique that has been growing over the last few years though it is definetly very old. Bay Raitt has done alot to promote this workflow and it is definetly very useful under certain circumstances.

If you need to deal with edgeloops in an aggressive way then you can certainly start with a vertex modeler like Maya and bring that into ZBrush. The emphasis on edgeloops, I fear, is alittle over blown in some cases and you always have to remember the whole pipeline when thinking about these things.

While massive amounts of edgeloops works for the modeler who needs to put detail in certain areas it doesn’t always work for the rigger who has to make that area keep its volume, feel like muscles are under their and other such things. Most major studios, if they have switched to polys, still work with models that have Nurbs like topology. This allows them complete flexibility when designing the rig. The modeler is only the first step.

I have had modelers at Sony tell me that ZSpheres have good topology.

You will find that this topic is a bit of a running target. everyone is still trying to find out what works for them and it all depends on local circumstances. I would suggest trying out different options and getting a feel for what is out there.

I would also suggest that you just open ZBrush and start working. Forget about topology and things like that. As you advance you will see where changing your topology would be useful and where it isn’t. Then you can make your own informed decisions. :slight_smile:

r

Thanks!..sadly i don`t have zbrush 2, i thought that i could download the demo version from pixologic but i dont know if is to OLD, any idea of when the version 2 is goin to be availabe as demo?..

Actually Im trying to my artworks 100% in zbrush, even the low res mesh.

But its true tht in production, you have special technical constraints (polygon organisation, uvs etc…) that require a base done in an external rogram…

But, ine the case of a character, you can build your low res base mesh very fastly zith zshperes, certainly ,uch faster than any other programm…

If your beginner, I recommand you to import very low res mesh build on mya, for exemple.

Once you know well wbrush, the tools, manipulation, you will be enaugh at ease to build verything inside it…

But the choice is your…

have fun!

thanks Sebcesoir

Really? I always just assumed that z-brush topology was not that good because you have so little control over it, and some other posts on this forum…

I have tried making meshes in Silo but with traditional modelling I always make a mess… when im trying to get create more geometry where it is needed… i always find it very difficult, keeping it all quads. :mad:

Hey pixelsoul- the question of whether something is good or not depends on your expectations or needs. For creating base meshes I use ZSpheres because they are easy and enough for me to work with. For the majority of your model they should be fine as they offer the most flexibility come rigging time later on. For areas around the hands and feet, things can become more delicate. Also the face is an area where one could want a lot of control.

What modelers have to watch for the most is what they call “extraodinary verticies”. These are verticies with more than four edges connected to it. These verticies can cause pinching while rigging and while modeling. They are almost always required in poly modeling and the placement of these verticies is one of the tasks that a modeler has to deal with.

Beyond that there is edge flow to consider but this is the running target I mentioned earlier where so much depends on local circumstances and your final rigging solutions. For example, a skin simulation rig requires that you have very evenly distributed poly faces with minimal edgeflow. The dynamics calculations are designed to run with evenly distributed and excessive edgeflow would disrupt this and cause all kinds of artifacts. also, muscles systems can sometimes work against edge flows so you will want to establish as little in the way of model strictures as possible so that the muscle simulation can create the feeling of volume and reality.

I have known a few students to leave school filled with edge looping knowledge who have found that production was not interested in their edge looping skills and wanted them to have more NURBS-like modeling skills. That happened to me right out of Gnomon and I was turned down for at least two jobs because of this or so the reasons went. :slight_smile:

I hope this helps clarify. ZSphere topology is great, if it fits your final goal. You have to assess these things in terms of a pipeline.

Best,

Ryan

Can someone explain to me please exactly wath is GOOG TOPOLOGY…is just a clean mesh with four side POLYGONOS?..
I thought that zbrush topology was good because the models always have a mesh with 4 side polygons…
Also what is edgeloops?..is it mark an area with a circle, like the eyes, mouth,etc?..

THANKS

hey yolao,

i think those wonderfull and talented people are talking about topology for animation workflow…(how poly are agenced together is important for good deformation during anim…)
If you make still pics only that’s not really a problem IMO
The greatest actual tool to fix topo afterward is silo and its topology brush (the uv editing is still missing in the actual version though)
Some people make wonderfull model starting in zbrush then going in silo…

thanks Janimatic

Yes i have seen a similiar technique on the gnomon dvd human anatomy only then it draws lines on the figure and does it by hand in maya… i believe i had seen that in silo you can draw these lines directly on your mesh and it will build from there… so that would mean that good topology in z-brush is never needed correct as you can always go back and redraw the topology after you finished the model. and let them follow muscle tissue and give detail where its needed…

yes but be carefull,

don’t go in details uv maping and texturing before rebuilding the topology!

hey
this is the exact reply to your question :
http://www.zbrushcentral.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=27001

GREAT LINK, THANKS:D