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#41

@Twitchmonkey: I think that you were not following the thread closely, which is fine :slight_smile: No misunderstanding or wrong feelings. We both are trying to help him.

Yes all the things you said are possible as long as you have mastered certain things like the tools and the anatomy. If you are good at facial anatomy, you can turn 1 mil sphere into a nice head without needing plane construction. But the fact is that he is just starting and he needs alot of practice in many directions. Second thing is that he is not trying to make a base mesh for ZB, he is just studying the facial planes in 3dsmax rather than ZB. I have asked him to just focus on planes that is why it is better if he works with the tools he is comfortable with. Because in ZB he goes berserks and works on wrong ideas or parts. His mesh is not a topology study, it is a facial plane study. I have asked him to replicate Loomis`s drawing. That drawing is a precious one and everyone should study and replicate it frequently as a study, including myself.

#42

Ah, well if the goal is mastering facial planes in 3ds Max, then the base mesh is of some importance. I had assumed you had a problem with the validity of my method, but I now see (I think) that you were simply stressing a different approach. I apologize for not following the thread and was just addressing the issue I perceived you having with my post.

Now that that’s addressed, onto creating the facial planes in 3ds Max. There are issues with triangles, but those can be fixed by simply applying a symmetry modifier to one of the sides (one doesn’t appear to have as many) and then making some minor edits to fix the others. Still though, those are not the issue, not concerning facial planes. However, I personally don’t see how you can do much more with the amount of polies you have. Most seem to follow the basically correct flow of the facial planes as I understand them. Some work could be done on squaring the chin, and the row of edges surrounding the center of the neck could perhaps be moved out.

I would pay particular attention to your subtle, curving forms. I would not have those at this point. Strong planes bring power and legitimacy to a face, and curving will inevitably happen as a result of smoothing, so don’t be afraid to square off those curves.

Hopefully some of this helped and I didn’t step on anyone’s toes.

#43

wowoowowow…

i just got up,siwtched on the pc…and i c this…the most amazin debate i have ever ceen…

thnx twtch monkey for taking so much of u r time and trying to help me out…
it means a lot to me…

KurSAD-THNX brother…and did u check the muscle study and th plane study…
i am even sketching the head when i have free time…
hope i m goin in the right direction:D .

ZAIN

#44

i know that brother kursad will kil me…(come on yaar was real bored of studing the planes…but still sorry for jumping in details):wink:
but stil just for fun tried my own orc out a base mesh that i had made, to c how does the plane help…and i gues its good…wats say!!!
zaoib copy.jpg

#45

Not bad…but it needs more volume. And planes. Moar planes! Also, the underlying anatomy doesn’t make too much sense. Even orcs can benefit from logical human facial anatomy.

#46

The main mistake ppl always do is they usually sculpt something like orcs , trolls , elves , draculas and other humanoids without knowing human anatomy . How to make really good orc ? make right anatomical human face then just exaggerate some details and whoala :slight_smile: You have cool orc . It is not necessary to just learn planes of the head all the time . I mean it is very helpful , but try to make some other things too . For example you could study planes 3 hours then take a picture of the head and try to sculpt it using planes techniques . Do these exercises every day and you will be shocked by what will happen after few months of practice :slight_smile: Oh and before going sleep try to draw human heads using references :slight_smile:

#47

twitch-thnx a lot brother…just thought of sculpting the head for sum fun…i was realy bored doing the studies and the other excersises that i m doin for the head…so i gues u wil better than this in future

athiandr-u r absolutely right buddy…but u c sumtimes ambition overtakes displine and people like me do crappy things like this(its not my fault coz u guys make amazing stuff)
but tried to make as close to human anatomy but i guess reviews says dint happen…
but thats ok…i wil get better
thnx

#48

Aye, just keep balancing study and practice. If you consistently learn more and practice applying what you’ve learned, the work is bound to improve.

#49

you certainly seem to be making progress so keep it up:+1: and don’t feel bad about having fun, as having fun should keep you passionate about sculpting which in turn will help you improve.

one thing I think you need to work on which I don’t think any one has picked up on yet is that you don’t have ears on most of you character, and although planes of the face are important they wont make anyone look real if they have no ears.

so carry on with the advise from every one else it seems to be helping, have fun and show me some ears;)

#50

No question. The lack of ears really does throw off a sculpt. Plus, they’re perhaps the most difficult element of the face to properly create. I recommend looking into video tutorials like this one to learn how to make them.

Alternatively, for a quick and easy (if a bit cheap) ear, you can purchase Erklaerbar’s Zbrush Funpack from here which contains a ear-making brush. Not ideal, but it can help add that extra touch of realism to your work if you don’t want to take the time to model your own ear.

#51

It is definatly an improvement, although i do recommend not to built to much of a body build type kinda guy;) because these will mess your correct anatomy up real fast if you do not 100% understand the anatomy.

It would be a good idea to google some anatomy pictures and study them real good.

Also one other tip: a dynamic pose is REAL important for creating a interesting model, really it is a world of difference.

I’m not saying this HAS to be done at this point as your still learning the anatomy and all(which is even more important) but keep in mind that,when you feel like taking the next step, a dynamic pose is REALLY important.

#52

hg cg addict-thnx a lot mate…u r absolutly right so listening to ur advise…i have made a new base mesh…with ears…:smiley:

twitchmonkey-its an honour to c u repling to my posts as ur such a talented zbrusher urself…pls do check my thread and keep on givinng ur cool advices
thnx a lot

slice-and coz of ur advise mate even tried posing my model so thnx

ok so after 5 days of ultimate sketching(wil post my sktches sumtime)…i m back…
wel…i dont feel my anatomy skills have impoved much but wanted to show u guys the stuff that i m working on…
well…this model is like an exam for coz all the things that i hav leanrt til now like the face planes,sum anatomy,etc etc…
i wil try to apply it in this model and have promised my self not to go bove sublvl 3…
pls dont expect even a single bit of details as i m a noob and m working creating the correct mass(and KURSAD will KILl me)
pls check it out…
[attach=110654]ZBrush Document.jpg[/attach]

Attachments

ZBrush Document.jpg

#53

a smal updat on the guy!!!
ddd.jpg

#54

yeti-
just to show want i m upto…i hav done sum crapy things in photoshop…
pls check it out and let me know!!!
ZBrush Document.jpg

#55

hey guy.
just try to stand like him. look at your left hand.
i just attached a scribble that you know what i mean:

ZBrush_Document_verbesserung.jpg

#56

WETHAND-thnx a lot for that advise…but i lack the skill for now to do it…tried a lot but i had gone to farto change it…
thnx a lot.

wel…an update on the same guy…
333.jpg

Attachments

sdsd.jpg

#57

you’re never too far to change it…that is the beauty of ZBRUSH!!! it’s all craetivity, you can worry about the work flow when you’re done. When I started in 3d I wanted to do characters, but Zbrush wasn’t here yet, and pulling verts all day was too tedious for me. So I settled on doing realtime 3d for marketing firms and architechs. Now that Zbrush is here, I do nothing but characters in my spare time, I waste countless hours on these formus helping other people see the light and get away from workflows and back to creating.

You’re getting better, you just need reference, ALWAYS reference!!! if you’re not going off an image, then you’re already doing something wrong. You didn’t create humans, why are you trying to pull them out of your head? You, your friends, and everyone you know is reference. Buy a camera and take some pictures…there is very little that you can’t take an image of. People are one of those things that are so hard to do because we all look at them all day long…so why not put that in your creativity? You’re creating an image, a sculpture, but not humans, that’s been done…so rather than re-creating the wheel, just take a picture, and copy it.

You should also never start to texture before you’re finished sculpting. NEVER. textures don’t make the model, they make the texture.

#58

Goast got it pretty much right. Your sculpt is pretty good I’d say, but I don’t see why you’re so quick to abandon the simple T pose. I understand it can get boring making nothing but neutral poses, but they give you greater access to your forms and make making edits easier. Plus, when you pose your model, muscles will contract, pronate, supinate, and conjugate (well, maybe not that last one). What I’m trying to say is that the rules change when the body poses, and you can still learn a lot about how the body is put together when in a simple standing position. It just seems like you could still use some work on your foundation before climbring higher on shaky ground.

#59

Keep up the good work :slight_smile:

#60

goast666-THNX brother…i completely agree with u for watever u have said…
i m making HUMANS A LOT…and it is king of very challenging…the above guy i also a human…and i have not textured it…its a matcap…and i have made the eyes in PSD…
I promise u that i m gonaa take ur advise and sculpt sum refrnce photos…
actualy i m studying forms and a lil bit poses at the same time…but KURSAD brother has old me not to go above sublvl 3…so i coludn do much of detailin…
the above model was sculpted in 20,000 polys and not bove that…
pls do check my work whenever u have time and give ur expert advises…

thank u