Please solve the problem of the decimation master (There are no cases at all.)

[Rarth_Alpha]

When performing “decimation current” using the decimation master, a bug occurs in which all sub-tools are flipped upside-down, and the outside and inside are reversed.

You cannot specify which subtool is causing the problem (the subtool that causes the problem will be different each time you try) and undoing will not restore it to its original state.

It did not occur at all in the pre-process phase, and this error occurs randomly when only “decimation current” is pressed.

Checking all the options of the decimation master (freeze border, keep uvs, etc) was of no use at all. Even reinstalling, the same problem occurs.

Before importing in 3ds max, I have sorted the axes and reset the xform, everything I could do, but to no avail.

It is useless to append a new subtool using make poly mesh 3d in zbrush.

It is so large that it is impossible to save, load and work at every moment.

I tried to find a solution on google, but couldn’t find a case.

Here are the computer specifications.

OS Windows10 64bit
32 gb ram
CPU AMD Ryzen 5 1600 6core 3.2ghz
GPU gtx 1060 6gb

I’ve tried every method I can try, but I can’t find a solution.

[Spyndel]

Hello @Rarth_Alpha

Sorry you’re having some trouble!

@Rarth_Alpha

When performing “decimation current” using the decimation master, a bug occurs in which all sub-tools are flipped upside-down, and the outside and inside are reversed.

You cannot specify which subtool is causing the problem (the subtool that causes the problem will be different each time you try) and undoing will not restore it to its original state.

I’m a bit confused here and need you to clarify:

• “Decimate Current” decimates the active subtool (and should have no effect on any other subtool).

• “Decimate All” decimates all visible subtools–each in turn. It is just an automation of the process of Decimating each subtool individually. This is why you can’t undo them all at once–you would have to go in and undo each subtool individually.

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If you’re seeing each subtool decimated in turn, you are using “Decimate All”. In this case, have you tried going through a decimating each subtool one by one to see if you can find a problematic subtool(s)?

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If you truly are using “Decimate Current” have you merged all your subtools into a single subtool? Try splitting them apart again and decimating them individually.

[Rarth_Alpha]

The decimation current is correct and has not been merged.

I think I can’t find such cases in the surroundings or other communities, so it is likely to be my computer problem, so I am going to format it. If you have a reason, please reply. Thank you for answer

[Spyndel]

It is unlikely to be a problem with your computer. It is most likely a problem with the geometry in your tool or how it was constructed, but the things you are telling me dont make a lot of sense. I would need to see a complete uncropped image of your interface with the subtool palette open both before and after, as well as the exact Decimation Master settings you are using in order to make any sense of it.

In the meantime, if it is only the normals of a single subtool getting flipped, you can fix this with Tool > Display Properties> Flip for the problem subtool.

If you are using Decimate Current, then only the active subtool is a factor in this. Switch off the visibility of any other subtools or enter solo mode so all you see is the active subtool. This will result in less confusion and give you a clearer idea of what is going on.

It may be that the geometry of that tool is problematic for some reason or another. Try remeshing it. If it has any UVs, try deleting them before decimating.

[Rarth_Alpha]

I know that the decimation current decimates only the currently selected mesh.
And of course, when working, I set it to solo mode and proceed.

Don’t you understand what the problem is?
When i finish detailing and decimate one mesh,
Randomly flips the top, bottom, left and right of all meshes, and the inside and the surface of the mesh.

It is not recovered by undo, and it is loaded in the same state even if the existing normal file is loaded again.

As said in the text, I don’t know which mesh will cause that bug.
Even fine meshes that are decimated will have a bug that will flip over if you try it later.
The mesh where the bug occurred is also decimated fine. The frequency of occurrence cannot be predicted at all.

I formatted the computer and tried again, but it is the same symptom.

When refining the mesh, the remeshing process has already been completed.
No UV

Before importing to zbrush, I ran a reset xform in 3ds max and proceeded to adjust the geometry of the mesh to 0,0,0. Is there any problem with geometry?

If i go through make poly mesh 3d, there is no change in symptoms.

Let me show you how the bug occurred

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1. This is what a normal full mesh looks like.

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2. To activate the decimate, turn off another subtool and proceed to the decimate.

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3. The subtool is flipped upside down and inside and outside.

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4. Disabling solomode puts all sub-tools that have not been decimate upside down (again, it worked as decimate current, but stupidly did not press decimate all).

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i try again default settings, but it occurs again same symptons.

[Spyndel]

Thanks for uploading those images. It gives me a lot of useful information.

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For starters, please upgrade to the most up to date version of Zbrush before seeking assistance. It’s impractical to try and troubleshoot an issue when a user may be missing important program fixes. This is free for registered users.

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At this point I’m just going to chalk up your problem to extreme memory issues. You’ve only got 1.3 GB of free memory available–the rest eaten up just by loading the file and whatever else you’ve got going on your system. Many cpu-intensive operations will fail to complete or return unpredictable results in this situation–program stability will be poor. There may also be a problem with your subtool geometry, but it’s useless to try and troubleshoot under these conditions.

Keep in mind that project files save all active tools loaded into them. This can rapidly bloat a file size size if you’re carrying around extra high poly tools you don’t need.

Try to save out ONLY the subtools that you absolutely need as a tool file (Tool> Save As). In the case of especially dense subtools like the main body, it may be necessary to save them out one at a time. You can delete all unnecessary subtools and save the rest as a tool file–it won’t change your project file as long as you dont save the project.

Completely close the program and reopen to ensure you have a fresh session. Load the more streamlined tool into the fresh session (dont load it into your previous file). With more memory to work with, the operation may complete. If it doesn’t then there still may be an issue with the subtool geometry, but you’ll have more breathing room to try and fix that now.

[Rarth_Alpha]

To sum up, do you mean that the CPU should be replaced with a better option?

Or does it mean you have to touch the zbrush mem settings?

[Spyndel]

It means your file is too large to work reliably on your system. That you can even open it is impressive. You’ve got to try and save out elements into smaller files so there is enough RAM left over for operations to complete. RAM is used to load large files into a Zbrush session, but Zbrush also requires RAM to complete CPU-intensive processes like Decimation, and the denser the mesh, the more RAM will be required. You’ve used all your RAM just to open the file, and don’t have enough left for the program to operate reliably. (In one screenshot, you have only 1.3 gb of available memory left after using 17.5 GB on just keeping the file loaded!)

According to your stated information you have a system that exceeds the recommended specs, so this would simply be a case of you not working within the limits of your system.

To repeat, there may also be an issue with the way your geometry is constructed that is causing the normals to invert, but it may also simply be caused by the program not having enough memory to successfully complete the operation. It’s useless to try and troubleshoot that until you are working with a file that isn’t falling apart under its own weight.

[Rarth_Alpha]

Okay. Thanks for the long answer. good luck!

[mashOnoid]

How did you solve the problem? Seems like its only you and me who are facing this problem. I cant seem to find any solutions online too. Let me know if you solved it. Thanks

[lukas.chrapek]

Hi all

I know that this is all topic, but it happened to me recently and in the past several times.

But I found a solution, which works for me, and I can replicate it in my files.
I wasn’t successful to replicate it in fresh files with default geometry (cylinders), so maybe my file is some kind of corrupted or something, or it needs more complex geo to replicate it than cylinder. Either way, here is what works for me.

I observe that this issue happened to me only when I was very close to subtool, that part of other subtools or selected subcool was out of document even in isolation mode.
When I click Decimate Current, normals of all subtool flipped and it corrupted file, because is not way back.
But when I zoom out to see all subtools in document and then click Decimate Current, decimation run ok without flipping normals.

Here are two gifs to show you what I mean:
Bad way:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/sh3x5spuvupfxfv/Decimation_corruped.gif?dl=0(image larger than 5120KB)

Good way:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/i9z9wjjqddxby7c/Decimation_ok.gif?dl=0(image larger than 5120KB)

I don’t know if it will be working for everybody, but it worked for me, so maybe it will help also you.

[Zojoel]

Yes I’ve been having this problem too. As Lukas mentioned, having the entire list of subtools framed within the viewport will avoid flipped normals/orientation when using Decimate Current.

[Nitram_2000]

Again, this is an old topic, but this bug is still present.

The workaround also solves it, but such a pain when you forget about it.

Do we know if this is being addressed?

[karelchytil]

Hi, the best solution is with selected subtool switching to Gizmo and there are Gizmo deformers …(that Gear Icon), just click on that gear icon, select “Remesh by decimation” and set some value with that yellow cone (with dragging it and releasing) . It works perfect all the time. Without flipping meshes

[xx_xx]

Cant believe this is still an issue in 2024