I’m pondering upon the idea of getting some of my mesh rapid prototyped. It’ll be nice to have some of them models on my desk 
I’m wondering if anyone has got any experience Rapid Prototyping ZB models? Where did you get it done and how much did it cost? Thanks guys!
I looked into it and decided that several hundred dollar are not worth the fun… I am sure that the cost is alright when you can ofset it against some income. But the guy’s owning a machine charge an arm and a leg and if you wish to buy a machine yourself you have to pay 22-35,000$ for a 3dprinter.
I am constantly having an eye on it 8).
Maybe you can contact a local sales office of one of the manufacturers and whine a bit and have them some stuff printed for cheap on their demo machines.
Lemo
Hi feureau, look in my signature and see “models”.There is one model I did as a steriolithography from Zbrush. The cost, because my models are 400 mm high, would be expensive had I not worked on the barter system.
For large models, 3darttopart.com is affordable.
For small figs, say miniatures, www.rapidprototype.com.au is pretty affordable, about $40 aus for a 28mm fig. They’re way cheaper than any we could find in the US offering the same resolution.
Other options, such as ABS plastic style prints, I haven’t a clue as to their expense.
My miniatures should be back in another week or so.
Hi, thank you all for the response.
Crusoe, I looked at 3dArt to part, their prices are quite fair, but the final product needs sanding to smooth out the surface. I don’t think that’ll work for models with “skins” like a godzilla. Though they have that triceratop thing on top of their site. I wonder how the finished product looked like in real life.
The ones from rapidprototype.com.au can print rings for jewelleries, does that mean they can print to metals? You mentioned ABS, … so, these are what kind of plastic? How did the details come out on your miniatures?
Those are nice models, pride. Did they come colored from the printer? I heard some of the printers can print 3D in full color. I wonder.
Thanks again you guys.
The color printer works like this:
- A thin layer of powder is spread across a surface.
- A print head, not unlike the one from an InkJet is ‘printing’ a adhesive onto that layer of powder.
- The next layer of powder is applied
- The next adhesive pattern is applied
- And so on, till the shape has been created in tiny layers.
Due to the fact that the powder can be in any color the shape can be colored, the adhasive also can be colored and thus the layers can have variations as well. Depending on the material/adhesive there are various things which can be done in the post processing.
The resulting surface of this process is ‘fuzzy’ and sand like. The layers are clearly visible. This technique will not be suitable for highly detailed ZBrush models. ZCorp is making those color printers.
Another Manufacturer prints ABS in a few colors directly and the result is pretty smooth but still shows the steps of the process. The models made with this are extremely durable.
The only thing which was VERY attractive in terms of insane detail is a wax printer which did not reveal any process related structure under a jewelers magnifying glass at last years siggraph. A-Friggin-mazing! Unfortunately the price as well…
The way to work with a wax model is three fold.
- You keep it as it is… (Yawn…)
- You create a mold from it and are able to produce replicas in any material your mold can stand.
- You create a metal objects using the ‘lost wax’ technique.
Lost wax technique:
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Make model out of wax.
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Add ‘channels’ which enable the air t go out while the hot metal enters the mold later, and where the hot metal actually will be poured into. SO, like a funnel on top of the head of a figure, and a few wires to the top from feet and hands. Later those will be cut off and polished away to be invisible.
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Your wax model will be set into a plaster mix (investment) in a metal cylinder called ‘flask’. The plaster is not real plaster but a seriously fine compound which can stand the heat of the molten metal. Once everything is in place, a mild vacuum is applied to remove possible air bubbles which can hide in little detail. A well made cast is so fine, it can reproduce a finger print.
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Into the oven it goes. The flask is heated up. HIGH. The wax burns out without any residue (special wax!). It is not advisable to do that indoors without vent 8).
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Now one of two methods are used to pour the metal into the flask (still in the oven).
a. vaccum. Metal is molten, flask is placed on top of a suction pad, metal is pured into flask, vacuum draws metal into crevices.
b. (FUN!) a mechanism not unlike a ferris wheel is wound up with a spring. Flask on one end of an arm, counterbalanced with a weight on the other side. Metal is molten, pured into a receptacle in front of the flask(still hot), and then the mechanism is released, spinning rapidly and forcing the molten metal into the flask with the centrifugal force. All has to happen rather rapidly to prevent problems with the molten metal and the flask cooling off (cracks in investment). Exhilarating procedure compared to the vacuum. When something goes wrong, molten metal goes flying all over the place…
Then the flask is taken of it’s respective holder, and is dropped into a bucket of water. The thermal shock converts the investment almost into powder. Now, for the first time, you can take a look at the result. If it looks bad for some reason, melt it again… If it looks good, take the supports off with regular metal working tools.
All this sounds more complicated as it is. It’s great fun. The components are affordable for casting. I’ve done it a lot… and actually… writing this up inspires me to look at ebay 8). Maybe some used equipment will fly my way 8))).
Now all I need is one of those 30,000$ Wax printers
:eek: :eek: :eek: :rolleyes:
Cheers
Lemo
PS:Another alternative is a proprietary and expensive sinter technique. The single pieces are not that expensive, but the base cost is high. Nothing for a quick shot.
A 4 Axis CNC mill could make very nice things. Those go for 3-5000$ including all the software and gear needed. They will not mill every Dino but if one would stick to the limitations of the tool great results could be produced and milled.
I’m thinking about trying out some modelprinting myself. What I’m curious to know is: do you have to take your Zbrushmodels into another program (CAD?) to make it printable? A lot of these companies want CAD objects or lithographs, and I’m not sure if Zbrush thinks in solid objects…
p.s. Wow Lemo, you’re quite an expert on this subject ain’t 'ya? 
You can give a .obj to any of the firms. If they do not know what to do with it… RUN AWAY! FAST!. They will be able to create what they need on the push of a button. Often smaller shops are happy to route/mill stuff for you if they can do it on their own terms regarding time. They can run it over night or in other ‘gaps’. I have a guy who will route in wood for a few bucks per square foot.
What you need in any case is a closed/solid model. ZBrush’s Sphere would cause problems. Lemo’s ZBrush sphere would not 8))).
The geomtry would be converted into the so called ‘tool path’. The entire process is equivalent to printing a document. Only in the last moment code is generated for the particular machine at hand. Otherwise all information is handled in published formats. So, the .obj could be read into Rhino3D or equivalent and there a .stl file could be created. An easy way in Rhino to end up with ‘solid’ geometry is to stuff everything into a boolean. Which means that you drop your modeling into a solid brick and then have rhino calculate the difference. Which then is a solid with a surface which is describing exactly all the surfaces of your modeling. All problems with intersections, single objects are gone. So… that single solid ‘blob’ will be exported as .stl file and read by a software (there is also a RHino Plugin) which translates that description of your geometry into a ‘tool path’. Which means that this software calculates the movement of the tool itself to carve out the geometry. That can happen in multiple passes using different tools for the purpose. 1. Rough out, 2. Detail, 3. fine Detail/polish. Considering multiple axis it can be pretty tricky and some software is, despite it’s claims, is not able to furnish a collision free tool path. Collision results in the carving tool jammed into the material and subsequent machine overload and so on… That’s where a simulator comes in. Another piece of software which interprets the output of the tool path generator (sometimes part of the more expensive tool path generator software packages). That will show you on screen what is going to happen on your mill/lathe/engraver. If all looks good, the data is put onto a medium and loaded into the pc connected to the machine (router engraver whatnot). A few hours later you can check out the result. Pretty amazing.
Cheers
Lemo
PS:In a former life I was chemical engineer and thus a variety of processes are more than familiar, and during my studies I learned to dissolve every problem 
. :lol: .
Thanks Lemo! I have to read it more precise when I have the time, but do I understand correctly that if my model is closed (waterproof) it will be read as solid?
Apart from Zbrush I have Lightwave, so I could do the Boolean trick there…
Well, must fly, more later.
Cheers!
Plakkie
I was at a jewelry manufacturers convention recently and saw some amazing samples of prototyping done by this company Best Cast They use a new machine called ‘Perfactory’ which can reproduce very high details. I was also amazed by some of the prices they quoted - seemed very reasonable.
Yes, waterproof is it.
If you can make the boolean in a nurbs based app then it would yield better results on the machine later as the tool path generation can live of the precision of the mathematical description of the surfaces rather than the 'hard 'faces and edges of a polygon model… I hope I express myself clear enough…
Lemo
PS:I made those pens in the past evenings on my lathe in my basement (everything is better than TV!).
Taking pic’s on the window sill does not yield the best results… :rolleyes:
PS:Perfactory is pretty cool, but it’s the most expensive from all the alternatives. I also heard that the photo polymer is not easy to integrate in certain work flows. But I’m not a specialist. And as an amateur this machine is WAY out of my league. Actually, I can buy a house here for that money they charge for it.
Lemmonnado, here’s some information from the Best Cast website, “Q:Are the printed parts directly castable from Perfactory?
A:YES we can print in a Green castable resin ( PIC100 ).” The size of the object is definately a factor for the perfactory process but for between $80 and $125 you can get a high detail resin copy of your object. Too bad there arent any good images on their website of the Perfactory result, I saw them in person and was vey impressed.
Those Pens are beautiful. Looks like Bakelite. The yellow one is very nice
I definitely check that out. They are a German company. Being a Kraut myself might help to barter something 
Lemo
PS:The wooden Pen is Walnut. The one which does not grow in the US any more. Only salvaged wood is available. Rare. The Bekelite is actually acrylic with car paint metal flakes. A home brew. Incredible depth. Pictures do not do justice. I will make better ones once I have my ‘tent’ set up.
Speak of the devil!
http://www.3d-miniatures.com/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=1
example:
http://www.3d-miniatures.com/show_image.php?id=20&scalesize=0&nocount=y
These alien miniatures ( which I will be selling shortly ) were printed on a perfactory and stand about 1 inch high. I found a caster who was able to mold from the master directly, and these will go into production shortly. The surface finish is very fine, a layer of primer and paint will cover the texture very easily. They look much rougher than they really are.