What I find most intersting so far is that everybody seems to be milling as opposed to other technologies. Althogh given that it’s much less expensive (equipment & cost of operations) I guess it’s not really a surprise.
Re; billrobertsons last post, I’ve done everything from having full scale foam pieces CNC’d and finished for molds, to RP parts (FDA, SLA, & FDM), to machined parts. The real key to all of it seems to be knowing the processes and choosing whats right for each application. The two things I can testify with certainty is that there is no financial reason to persue handcrafted over NC crafted in a professional setting, and good design will pay off in spades, where bad design will derail you into thinking you’re on the wrong track.
Also, I’ve debated subtractive vs additive RP with Bill Barschdorf (BNT Studio) and I would agree with him that if “Net Finish” is the only criteria for choosing a method, CNC machining will get the closest. This means how much work is needed to fully realize a part as 100% finished. Bill B. is getting pieces the size of a 1/2 dollor to 98% Net Finish. Thats damn good considering the scale. At this point Additive RP is still only about .005-.010 in layer thickness, therefore a similarly sized part will be in need of more finish work.
Bill,
The carved panel is about 12" x 22" or so… (from memory)
The Moulding was bout 6" wide and 1.25" thick…
IC
With the stl or dxf file loaded into mastercam, select TOOLPATHS from menu then choose SURFACE, you are then presented with surf/solid menu, in the menu you will find options to be set…
SURF/SOLID - set this to A(all)
This will then give mastercam, surfaces to drive on, then choose either rough or finish operations from the same menu.
mastercam ver 8.1
Ullach,
Interesting method… I can see how it would work but it would slow mastercam down. There may even be a need to go into mastercam’s configuration to bump the max allocations in order to pull in a large mesh…
Here is a method thats a bit easyer on the system because it does not even have to display a large mesh…
From the Main menu select _toolpaths
select _surface
Change _select to N
Change _CAD to Y
If you have a containment boundary change _contain to Y.
Select to rough or finish.
Select parallel or any other kind of tool path that will work.
Set up the operation.
When you click to OK, you will be prompted to browse for a CAD file on your system…
Select the STL file and wait.
Thanks,
IC
routb
Good method especially with large files, thanks.
I tested the possibility of machining parts of a object in zbrush by hiding areas of the object and then saving only the shown parts as an obj file, going through the same alignment process in app(s) to mastercam. It worked even holding the same position in relation to the whole object, could be used for going in to areas requiring smaller cutters for finer detail…still testing.
Bpmufx,
I did get a closer look at the [color=#800080]BNT4CNC site. The detail of those models just blows me away.
I would like to be able to create dimensional signs, large 3d figures for themed environments, probably in foam, and architectural elements in foam or wood. Things like the wood panel that routb designed.
I am really just getting started. I wanted to get a handle on some of the software and techniques that are used before investigating the hardware (cnc router) that I will need.
Are you presently doing CNC work? What kind?
I appreciate your help.
Steve
IC,
Man, I love that panel that was routed from your design.
Have you seen this site?
http://www.masterwerkes.com/about.htm
I got a link to that from a profile on the visual mill web site. This guy makes some really nice things.
I must thank you very much for the suggestions that you have made. First of all, the idea of Zbrush as an alternative to Artcam that I found on the other forum. Now, you have turned me on to Maya as a good starting point for creating the objects to be brought into Rhino and then Zbrush.
How much easier is it to create your designs in maya than it would be to just create them in rhino to begin with? I’m just thinking of ways to postpone the $2K investment in maya for a while. What sort of functions can be done in Maya that don’t exist in rhino?
Bit of an open ended question, but any thoughts would be appreciated.
Steve
If you’re only interested in polygon modelling, then spending $2000 on Maya probably isn’t the best way to go. A small, dedicated modelling program will suit your needs better because it’s focused on modelling, and will save you a lot of jack at the same time.
e.g. Silo and wings are two programs that are excellent polygon modelling programs. Wings is free. Silo is very inexpensive and offers a bit more performance for meshes with decent poly counts.
Happenby-
My advice would be to keep Rhino as your main app, you can do either NURB or Polygon Modeling there. Spend 1K on Mecsoft’s VisualMill Plugin for Rhino. and you’re off & running with a very robust CAD CAM suite. If I’m not mistaken, VisualMill brings OBJ files directly. Maybe someone can confirm this. Obviously keep Zbrush running as your sweetening tool for the models.
To answer your question. I do Special effects in film, mostly mechanical stuff and have gained a lot of experience with these processes. The good, bad and the ugly.
routb & ullach, Apparently, what you’re both referring to seems to be in V8.1 or higher.
I’m on V8.0 and see no such features. Any thoughts besides upgrading? The bank is closed if you know what I mean.
Ok, so I just came back from a shop where they’re running MC V9.0 and I ran through the proceedure as outlined by routb. It all worked fine. So to confirm that it is not available in V8.0.
Oh well, maybe there is another way to use STL files in MC that none of us are aware yet.
bpmufx,
Try changing the stl to nurbs, load in your stl file, then choose MODIFY from main menu, choose X TO NURBS option then ALL, then from next menu LINES
drag a window over selection DONE. This will work with SURFACE menu.
Hi all. I am printing a 1/4 wax master of female figure now. The figure
was “sculpted” in Zbrush then cut at points that will be mold joins so
it would fit in the printer.We couldn’t afford to tie up the high resolution
machine for the whole figure so the head and hands are at .02 mm
per layer and the body is at .2mm per layer in the styrene machine.
I will post photos of model when they are done. The motorcycle tires
on my website are done with the lower res machine.
Good to see other people doing similar stuff. I built my first manual
copy pantograph 32 years ago but the digital stuff is sure interesting.
David
Hi,
I like Maya over Rhino for modeling for a couple of reasons…
History is a big deal… Rhino is a set up and execute style of program… Create NURBS curves, sweep or revolve a surface and move the CVs of the original curve… Nothing happens to the surface! You have to generate a new surface every time you want to make a change. Maya maintains a relationship between the surface and the original entities used to create it. I can move CVs and watch the surface update until I like what I see…
Animation tools ROCK for modeling… Learn to rig surfaced design elements (like a leaf or a ribbon) to joints and deformers in Maya. Treat them as though you were rigging them to act in a feature film. Each new trick you rig to the surface gives your surface new powers to transform and become an original version of a design element. Copy as many of the same elements into a seen as you want giving each its own unique pose… Its quick and very powerfull.
Widgets are faithful friends and not to be taken for granted… Rhino does not have a widget! There are many ways around the “no widget thing” but once I got used to working with a widget I felt like Rhino was missing a very important fundamental tool. This is a simple tool that allows you to select something and do something to the selected object. There is a visual representation of the point that you are manipulating from… Think about that… Think about how many times you are turning on and off snap points, projection, ortho and changing views. How many clicks is that anyway?
More modeling tools in general… SubDs, Poly box modeling (with a widget), great NURBS modeling… All working well with History and animation tools… Thats not even the half of it…
All of the leafs in this image originated from the same “leaf Character”
Try that in ArtCam!
IC
Attachments
Those are beautiful routb. Very very nice.
I think you’re right about the rigging as a useful tool for modeling for prototyping. The basic modellers don’t have that, but that’s one niche that I’m desperately waiting for zb 2.5 to fill.
That Panel looks GREAT! I carved something equivalent once as I thought I’ll spruce up my kitchen with fancy doors… NO WAY! I’d still be carving 2 years later… Looks great! Is it a lot of work to ‘finish’ it once the router is done??
Cheers
Lemo
David,
So, do you create the figures from ZSpheres in Zbrush, or do you start in another program first? Do you take the obj from Zbrush and prepare them in something like Rhino for your CAM program? What CAM program do you use? Got any tips on an an efficient workflow for this sort of modeling?
It took some searching to find the motorcycle on your site. For those who are interested, go to “Gallery” and then go to the bottom of the page. Click on “More Figure Models”. It’s on the next page.
Do you have any pictures of the component pieces that would be combined to make a complete master? I take it that some of these pieces will be wax and some will be styrene? How are they put together, and how do you then make the mold?
Thanks for your input on this interesting subject.
Steve
IC,
Thank you very much for your detailed replies. I’m learning a lot.
I like how you think. It’s pretty funny to imagine preparing a grape leaf for a part in a feature film. Soundtrack “I heard it through the grapevine” Hahaha.
So, once you prepared the leaf “character” in Maya, were you able to give it organic detailing in Zbrush before bringing it back into Maya for posing multiple instances of it in your composition? Or, did you get the composition ready in Maya, scale it in Rhino, then detail whe whole thing in Zbrush one leaf at a time? I ask, because if you could do the organic detailing before taking the multiple instances of it, you could detail the leaf just once, right?
It seems that the composition is the real “Art” of this creation. I love the flow and balance that you have created with the leaves, the grapes, and the vines. Beautiful.
One last question, relating to Bill’s idea. Once zb 2.5 is out there, will it’s new rigging capabilities likely be able to do most of what Maya is doing for you now?
Steve
Happenby ,
When the part are out of the printers I will do a series of photos showing the
procedure from Zbrush to finished urethane resin figure.
I haven’t updated my model site in 2 years…I should.
David