Good lord this thread turned dramatic. :lol:
I hope one day I get good enough that my art starts a war too haha
Gee Luise… this is getting a bit far, that’s for sure. I think I’m being read a little sheered there. (Thanks for editing your post, Tabo666, that was kinda violent!)
Anyway, I gave my points about the piece of art itself, took the liberty not to do the usual praising and was upset about the involuntarily deceiving aspect of it in regards to the animation. Naturally I’m sorry for Alex, that I couldn’t contain my anger there. Just as exposed as the piece has been my reaction.
Now you kick me in the balls, honestly? Ouch.
Well, get back on topic then. I should’ve kept away from this to begin with, I know.
Same thought here :lol:
I don’t understand all the problem merged around the fact of being in top row, the work is fine, for sure there could be other works that deserve it as well (or more) but don’t make it for some reasons, if you analyze the trend you can actually see that guys at pixo tend to put there all works that highlight the use of the software in important productions, that show a different way to use it, or that plugs (this verb is very abused in this thread:D) the program to a big company such as for example…gnomon 
.
And, it’s not right nor wrong, and is not nepotism, is a way like another to promote the program, as taron said there are gazillions of sculpts that would deserve it as well for their beauty, realism, or both, but are noth there. well, i don’t think that this causes the same works to be less good, and sometimes avoids the topics to be filled with paged and pages of thumbs up (so that to see the images you have to search for those :D)
Being said this i think that the judgement of a work should have to be somewhat independent to the fact of being plugged (again…) or not, somebody pointed out very kindly the flaws of the composition, somebody made an in depth analysis of what could be tweaked more…the rest is only boring flame
jm2c
and i thought that it was about the art. why does getting “the top row” matter so much.?
i guess this is what happens when you become famous.!!
personally i dont like these demon/ zombie/ horror etc themes but your work is sublime and its always an enjoyment to see what the pros are up to…
In contrast to this- I know several talented artists who only post on public forums because they enjoy the ass patting due to name recognition, even on mediocre works.
Not saying yours is- just saying that it happens.
Dear Alex, your work is really weak for the top row
Everyone understands that you are the boss and the director of the entire series can be filled with your work
In my opinion the work of the average scores of such works (sotni! can) every year, but they are not seen
I advise you to reflect on their creativity, to criticize himself, standing before the mirror
Of the ten points objectively it can give no more than 7 balls and your animation here is not relevant, who are interested in this animation? here generally do Zbrush and not a bunch of programs where you do it
Itself is not expressive character is not remembered at all, and without animation work looks a gray
VampireD: Thanks!
GX@W: Indeed. I imagine that most plugs are the result of a thread that has been around for a little while and received a bunch of attention from the community first. This is probably the best solution.
-FoOD-: Thank you. Well, I think that constructive criticism is an important part of getting better. What hurts people’s feelings is when somebody says ‘that sucks’, with no reason. But when someone takes the time to explain what it is that they don’t like, or what they think isn’t working, then this gives the artist information that they can use to improve. So for example, people saying that my image is too busy, or the character needs to be separated more from the background… that I appreciate and listen to. I will probably not go back to the image and rework it, but rather take that advice into consideration for my next project. What I think should be best avoided is to say that you don’t like something because of the genre. If you don’t like anime, for example, it would be silly to say ‘those eyes are way too big and the spiky hair is stupid’. It is the same thing as looking at abstract art and saying that a 5 year old could do it. This is mean spirited and discounts the fact that the artist, and many others, like that type of thing.
Darukin: Thank you for taking the time to say all that. As I’ve said, I try not to take it personally and know that most people in here are actually trying to be constructive. But I agree that there are other threads on ZBC that very much deserve to be up there. There are many uber talents in here, especially when it comes to pure sculpture. People who are way better than me when it comes to form, detail, anatomy and so on. It is why I come here… to get inspired.
godsmacksyou: Thanks. I definitely was consciously thinking of Blizzard’s amazing stuff while working on it. I’ve come to know so many people in the cinematics dept there since my girlfriend started working there a few years ago… and their talent is intimidating no doubt. Perhaps this was my attempt to try to fit in with them a little when we hang out. Heh.
kolbyjukes: Dude, thanks… Wayne is one of my favorite artists so that is kind of you to say. Although I’m an ant compared to him! Haha. Nice to hear from you… hope you’re doing well!
Taron: Heh… ‘guilt of making me invest some hours on mystery island’. Haha. 
As I’ve said, I think you’re one of the most multi-talented people I know (art, music, vfx, programming, etc… truly amazing). I appreciate your comments and advice… and understand where you’re coming from now. People should know that Taron and I are friends and this is us just prodding each other. Don’t bash Taron… he’s a great guy and means well.
INFINITE: Thanks… well, most professionals don’t post, as you stated, simply because they’re very busy. Working 60 hours a week, having a family, etc, makes online forums less of a priority as time goes by just because it is hard to find the time. But we’re all human, so if someone does take the time to post and gets attacked, they may feel that it isn’t worth it, especially if they don’t need the recognition as they’re already busy working. I, however, enjoy posting when I can and this thread is still something that I see as a postive thing. I’m happy to get the feedback that I have, both positive and negative.
Darukin: Your plugin sounds cool…
SadamHu: Indeed, learning how to critique work is an invaluable skill. Actually, the only thing I now teach at Gnomon is a 7th term portfolio development class where that is all we do. Every week we look at everyone’s projects and try to point out what could be improved as a group. Once you start working it is important to be able to detach oneself from the work and accept the reality that revisions are just part of production. Having a good art director/lead/supervisor/etc who has a good eye and really knows what they want is so important. I know that if I had created this piece as a work project with talented art directors guiding the project, it would have turned out better. This is why WIP threads are a great thing to do on forums, so that feedback helps the development. I haven’t done that in awhile, but I really should try for my next one!
Taron2: Indeed, wish you were still in LA. Like I said above, I know that you’re trying to help and this is something everyone needs. Advice from artists like you is a gift that must be appreciated… even though you have a knack for sounding like a life coach. Haha. 
broadstroke: Thanks. I know that it is impossible for people not to make the connection of Pixologic/Gnomon in regards to a plug being biased. But in the end this dialogue has been great and it does really make me want to work harder. Clearly it would make Gnomon look bad if I sucked, and makes Gnomon look good if I don’t. As time goes by the bar just keeps getting raised and I must say that it is also more difficult as I get older to find the time for personal work (gnomon/kids/etc). Fifteen years ago, back when the group of us posting 3D work online was tiny (Stahlberg, Engleman and not too many more), it was easy to stand out… now it is another story. The tools are getting better, computers faster, and the global community is just improving every year (hopefully Gnomon DVDs have helped). But at the same time, it is great to have such a larger community with which to communicate and get inspired by. So anyhow… must… work… harder… oi!
Taron3: Heh. Agreed… But yeah… Lightwave? ick. Let’s just turn this into a software flame war. Kidding! Hate those… always pointless.
Tabo666: Thanks for standing up for me, but I’m glad you edited whatever was originally there (didn’t see it), cuz Taron really is a cool guy. But calling him a lamo did make me chuckle.
KillahPriest: No doubt. Well, its better than reality tv.
Taron4: Ok, now you need a hug. I’ll grill you some of my peppers and send them in the mail, in return for something from Oli.
danko75: Thanks… I think things are settling down now.
tyrellcorp: Thank you.
testure: Hmm… well, that’s definitely not me. Heh.
andrey DRON: ah, a perfect example of a negative post. My work is weak, the animation is not relevant, and who would be interested in such a thing, or something made with programs other than Zbrush. If you can’t provide constructive comments, I think it would be best to just not say anything. Out of ten points I get seven balls? Heh. Balls? Sounds quite manly to me. Plus, this is your second negative comment in this thread. The other was ‘weakly for gnomon’. I got the point the first time. With that said, I think your prince demon character is really cool. Perhaps you’re an example of someone who is pissed that you didn’t get top row for that. Well, I think it is awesome.
Whew… ok. Well, I was gonna post some wip images today but I’m kinda scared to now! Heh. We’ll see.
-Alex
I wish i had seven ballz… Seven low hangin, fire emitting, totally kick @ss SATANIC ballz!!! 
Keep banging away Alex. Ive seen a ton of progression since your earlier works of a few years back.
ahhh very cool replies - people skillllzz and yeah thats what i mean by a negative reply - fair enuff is someone mentions or gives advice on how to improve a piece but to just bash it
- yeah that can suk but looks like these things dont bother you too much - well any way i like the piece - reminds me of a game intro I would wanna play
Umbelievable work! a lot of CORE details.
Everytime that I see you work is a new kind of learning! a journey.
Keep rocking! keep Rocking! 
small_orange_diamondsmall_orange_diamondsmall_orange_diamondsmall_orange_diamond
as I first saw the video and the image, I thought it lacked a bit of the “punch” which usually top row pictures have… what is then happening here? By no means am I saying that it shouldn’t be up there, on the opposite, because I know what a pain in the *ss is to create something like that on your own. But after watching that the post belonged to A. Alvarez, it was clear to me that it was going to cause some kind of revolution in the forum. After all, everyone knows who Alex is…
The problem is, we are already used to PHOTOREAL quality, which is indeed great, but doesnt have to be the standard anyway, and whenever we see something “perhaps-not-as-good” making it to the top row, specially coming from such a known name… it happens what just here happened.
Congrats Alex, all the criticism just means that people expect a lot from you, which is actually good, even though it might not sound like that at first sight. Like a teacher that doesn’t give you the best marks at the beginning of the year 'cause he wants you to do better than that, and he knows you’re capable of it.
And to everyone else it’s also good news, it’s hard to get a top row, but not impossible, so keep working hard and it will just happen…
i really hope that all of these negetive vibes dont put you off from posting more of you work man…
What a beautiful work Alex, i found it strangely hypnotic. I like the understated animation, always harder to achieve than the in yer’ face stuff. Congrats
Man this forum has gotten really soft over the years, someone offers feedback and you all crucify them for it? , sad.
I have to say reading Alex’s replies I think he handled it all in the best way possible and that says a lot about someone’s level as an artist that can handle criticism even when its not constructive (not to say that it was not).
For me I do not care for the image itself feels have others have said dated, but I do appreciate what the artist was trying to create with the animation and its very well done on that level.
The mood ,atmosphere , sound all the little touches made it compelling to watch.
Nice work Alex, 
wayniac: hahaha… nice.
-FoOD-: Heh. Well, 13 years of running a company gives you a pretty thick skin I guess. I’ve dealt with far more stressful things. In my experience, however, I’ve learned that some people are often totally ready for things to escalate, almost as if they look forward to it. So if you don’t want to start a war that is gonna be a drag on your spirit, just waive the white flag. Cuz in the end, it isn’t worth it and they’re probably not as evil as you initially want to believe.
Ardox: Thanks!
manusito: Yeah, I don’t buy into the photoreal thing personally. Just because it is possible to make a render that looks like a photo, doesn’t mean everyone should be striving for it. When I see things like ‘The Third and the Seventh’, I am totally blown away by its realism and beauty… but at the same time that just belongs to a genre which is one of very many. Painters are not expected to only paint in a photoreal style just because it is possible, but many people are easily impressed by something that looks real, even if the subject matter is boring and not very creative. To me a photoreal painting or 3D render of a fruit bowl is still just a damn fruit bowl. Take a photograph and save yourself the trouble. But I’m kidding of course… I appreciate the skill that goes into such things. But if I had to do it I would get bored. When I went to art school most of what we did was from life (figure drawing, still lifes, landscapes, etc) and I was bored to tears. I learned a lot of technique, but creatively I gained very little.
tyrellcorp: Nope… I’m sticking around. Thanks.
handlebar: Thank you.
-Alex
Here are some more images… Originally I just made the character, as he was based on a sketch and was going to have a simple, probably 2D background. Then I decided to make an environment and initially the composition was going to be vertical. I eventually switched to horizontal once the idea of making an animated loop for a monitor popped up. Also, the bg was initially flipped horizontally from what it is in the final, but the character was blocking what is probably more interesting, being the depth of the scene.
character: base mesh in Maya, old humanoid model that was tweaked a little to match my sketch. Sculpted in Zbrush, then retopo’d in Zbrush once the sculpt was done. UVs done in UVlayout with two UV regions.
Scythe: 2D sketch in Photoshop, Base Mesh in Maya, Sculpted in Zbrush with HD geometry, around 40million polys. This was the first time I used HD geometry… really cool.
Environment: Super simple basemesh in Maya based on a Photoshop sketch. Sculpted in Zbrush, UVs in UVlayout. Renders are from Maya, using normal and displacement maps, prior to texturing.
This is what it looks like in Maya:
-Alex
Attachments
really digging the breakdown images… soooo much work… I’m a bit shocked of how some ppl in threads have so much bitterness and lack of professionalism… shows u how even 3d communities are not Troll proof… I see the point of some, cuz you can appreciate the piece and also put your input on where you would have taken it if it was yours… but I dont think this project lacs of any of the merit given… I haven’t been in the industry enough to be considered an OG like alex I guess… because I remember being in school back in the early 2000’s looking at the legacy he’s been creating with gnomon and his work. opening the doors for so many artist and me wishing to some day be somewhere up there in the industry and meet him… I feel lucky I got the chance.
many old school 3d artists that Ive meet don’t even do that much art anymore… I can model but even tho Ive done it before I don’t keep up with animation, composting and fx like he does… if having such a huge palette of skills, and on top of that keep impulsing so many artists with the gnomon bump is not enough to have a top row in a forum for this ppl… man… I dont know what is.
Mr Alvarez:
Thanks for posting this, and for the breakdown. And kudos to you for answering everyone’s comments with such civility. I appreciate you posting the construction shots as well.
I think your work shows an amazing depth of artistic and technical knowledge over a huge range of disciplines. I’m always inspired by your attitude to learning. I’ve learnt a lot of what I know from Gnomon dvd’s, and am grateful for what you’ve provided to the community. I find it’s hard to access quality education in this field in developing countries, and I (and many others I know) have benefited hugely by the efforts of you and your company.
Again, thanks for posting.
nice try posting the WIP shots. you still suck and I hate you.
:lol:
I knew, before I even read, who did this piece. Definitely his style. Even though the animation was a bit uneventful (sorry Alex), I think people are missing the amount of work and expertise that went into the particles, rigging, compositing…and all the other stuff I know nothing about.
The good part is that Alex probably recorded the whole thing!
I enjoyed it. Thanks.