Plakkie

Topology & Flow Lab

The ability to create new topology for your models is a gift from heaven. Goal of this thread is to get as much information about topology-editing together in one place. Feel free to post all your experiences, experiments, questions and answers about topology here, so we can learn from one another.

I'm compiling all the information into the first post. Questions and answers go into a Q&A list. If you can answer an open question, please post in this thread, and I will put the aswer in the first post, with an honourable mention of your name.

Quickstart guide

1. Load in your model (must be a polymesh, the standard primitives don't work)
2. Go to Edit mode (T)
3. Click on the ZSphere button in the Tool menu. Now a Zspere will appear automatically.
4. In the Tool menu two new options have appeared: Rigging, and Topology. In Rigging, press 'select' and select your model that you want to edit.
5. In Topology select ‘Edit topology’. Now you can start drawing lines.

Andreseloy has made a quick Zscript to show the basic procedure.

General controls

• To add a point: LMB-click on desired spot.
• To delete a point: ALT-click on point.
• To set a new starting point: CTRL-click on point.
• To select a point: LMB-click on the point.
• To deselect a point: LMB-click outside your model.
• To move points: go from Draw mode to Move mode.
• To move more points together: increase the drawsize.
• To scale points: go to Scale mode. (works best with larger draw size)
• To delete a connection-line without deleting the connected points: insert a new point in the middle of the line and delete that point.
• Use Shift-LMB-click to convert the underlying geometry into the new topology. (area affected depends on brush size) Use Shift-ALT-LMB to unerase the geometry, or just SHIFT-LMB over an already painted area. (only deletes topology created with Shift-LMB)
  

Extra Info: sometimes certain points won't move at all. Chances are you have accidently masked them. (you can't see this) Unmasking the points makes them move again. (Thomas Mahler)

Editing existing topology

1. Load the model you want to edit
2. Select a new ZSphere tool.
3. Clone your model.
4. Make sure that the subdiv level of the cloned model is at 1 or 2 (If you don't, it doesn't work! The original model can have as high subdiv levels as you like)
5. In the Tool:Rigging subpalette, select the original model, and activate (optional) the Projection Mode, so that the model which will be generated is projected on the Template.
6. In the Tool:Topology subpalette, select the cloned model. All the lines will show up.
7. Enter the Edit Topology Mode.

With a big thanks to Francois Rimasson for his wonderfull tutorial!

Here's Plakkie's Zscript showing how to edit existing Topology.
Bonecradle has made this PDF tutorial showing this workflow on an imported .obj file.

Topology Painting

You can also get access to existing topology by painting it on! While you are making a new topology give your brush some size and press Shift-LMB-click while painting over the reference mesh. The underlying geometry should now appear as new topology! (you may have to rotate the model a bit to get the screen refreshed) Pressing SHIFT-ALT-LMB erases the painted topology, and only the painted topology. You can also just SHIFT-LMB over an already painted area, the brush then goes into erase mode. When you make new topology by the simple clicking method and afterwards paint over topology on the same spot you get two layers of geometry. [thumbs up for Crusoe the Painter and Rhumba for finding this out]

ZScript showing Topology Painting (by Plakkie)

Topology and Subtools

As of yet the topology tool only works with the selected subtool, and not a complete object with subtools included. Pixologic has stated in the release post that topology and projection are functions under development, so we can expect more improvements in the future.
For now, Ralph Stumpf has presented this workaround:
"As a workaround in the moment you can export the second subTool as "obj" and import back with "import" "add". For this the active subTools can't have levels. Then you have only one tool and topology works."

Creating a topology mesh over a Zsphere model

You can create a skeleton of ZSpheres and wrap it with a topology mesh, while still being able to use the ZSphere-Skeleton as a Rig!

1. Create a skeleton of ZSpheres just like the ones you use in ZSphere-Modelling.
2. Under Tools:Topology, click on Edit Topology.
3. In the Transform menu, activate the buttons: >X< , and the key to it all: Local Zsphere-Symmetry (Local Radial Count-Value determines how many lines will be drawn around the Zsphere-Skeleton).
4. Activate 'Draw'-modus.
5. Set your starting point with Ctrl + LMBclick on the desired spot on your Zsphere structure.
6. Click, release, move a little bit and click again. Around the ZSphere-Skeleton appears a topology!
7. Preview the mesh with 'a'.
8. To use the ZSphere-Skeleton as a rig to pose your new mesh, deactivate the button Edit Topology and you can deform (Move, Scale etc.) the skeleton again; the created topology will follow the rig.
9. After you have finished your topology-mesh, you transfer it into a skin-mesh by Tool:Adaptive Skin > Make Adaptive Skin. Note that Edit Topology must be deactivated for that.
10. Now select the ZSphere-Skeleton as the active tool and scale the ZSpheres somewhat smaller so they fit all inside the new mesh.
11. Now press Tool: Rigging > Select and select your new created mesh , click Bind, et voilà, your mesh has a cool rigg.

Extra Info: When retopoing zspheres, under Display Properties you can size them so they show smaller than the skin/rig you are making. You can also quickly shrink down the zspheres for doing things like fingers, then scale them back up. (Crusoe the Painter)
Extra Info: You can turn edit topology off, add more zspheres, and then turn it back on! Then you can add more mesh-zspheres, connect them up, et voila! So if you make a bust, and later want to give it a body, you can, as long you saved the bust zsphere rig! (Crusoe the Painter)



Rastaman is currently exploring this under-documentated technique. He's made a more detailed and illustrated tutorial. Check it out!
He also made this ZScript showing this technique.

Topology Mesh Extraction

With the topology tool you can easily create extra geometry like clothing, armor, etc. In comparison with the Mesh Extraction tool you have more control over the topology of the created geometry.

1. Setup a model for topologizing as shown above.
2. Set Tool:Topology > Skin thickness to 1. This will give the geometry shown in preview, 'a', some thickness. Smaller values, thinner geometry.
3. When finished drawing topology press Tool:Adaptive Skin > Make adaptive Skin.
4. The new geometry can now be put into the subtool list of your original model if you wish.

Here's a ZScript showing topology extraction, made by The Namek.



Topology Rigging

Rigging with the topology tool? Yes, it's possible! Although the function needs further development from Pixologic, it has potential, offering some advantages over and alternatives for transposing and the standard rigging method.
So far two different methods have been found. The goal is to quickly and easily rigg meshes with any level of subdivision, by using the topology micro-ZSpheres.

Yellow Soul Rigging

First found by Dargelos, this quick rigging method shows a yellow ghost object while rigging, hence the name Yellow Sould Rigging.

1. Open your mesh-model.
2. Clone it with the high subdivision level.
3. Clone with subdivision level 1 (note: the original high-poly-mesh is not displayed in the selection-dialogue, so you always have to work with two clones !)
4. Apend a zsphere as a subtool to your original model tool and resize it.
5. Select the zsphere so you can see the topology and rigging submenus and hide the model subtool (eye-symbol in the subd-panel)
6. Select the high-poly-clone in rigging menu and the unsubdivided clone (level 1) in topology menue
7. Delete your selections so you can only see the yellow soul
8. Click onthe zsphere and draw new microspheres just clicking in your desired places they won´t go to the infinite or the surface they should stay inside the mesh
9. When you have finished your structure select the subdivided clon in rigging menu and press bind to start posing.
10. You can move scale or rotate. the best results are achieved by selecting the "bone" line betwen 2 microspheres and rotate it.

Because you cannot later get rid of the yellow mesh while rigging yet, it's further use (beside the cool 'Yellow-Soul'-look) is a little limited. But if you preview your by this technique posed mesh-model via pressing 'a' on your keyboard, the yellow 'soul' disappears and you see your model in a new pose. So Dargelos way of setting up a rigg is quick and comfortable to use and an overal big step forward in the rigging features if we could get rid of that yellow-'soul'-mesh.

Get started right away with this model, rig and pose by AngelJ.



Convert to Main Rigging

Pixologic implemented the 'Convert to main'.. As we already know, you can use the converted topology as a surface-rigg, but limited to low-poly meshes, otherwise Zbrush always freezes or crashes. Rastaman suggested the reason for this lack could be a programming bug so that Zbrush 'looses' the surface from one point on and goes with its calculation into infinite. So why not show Zbrush the borders ?

The following step-by-step workflow was made by Rastaman.

1. Load or create a mesh-model in the subd-poly-level you want to pose (the highest subdivision-levels are also possible), draw it on the Canvas, press EDIT. (If you like to pose later with different subd-levels, it's a good idea to produce some clones of your master-model. You do this by pressing Tool:Clone while your mesh-model is active and in the desired subd-Level)
2. Choose a Zsphere as active tool.
3. With the Zsphere active you open the Tool:Rigging-panel, press Select and choose the mesh you want to pose. If your model does not appear in the Select-dialog for some reason, try to clone your model. The clone should now appear in the list.
4. Now press Tool:Topology:Edit Topology and you can start drawing an ordinary topology in the shape of your desired rigg by simply LMB-clicking on your model. You can activate symmetry if you need it.
5. As you can see, your topology points are located on the surface of your model as usual. When you are satisfied with it, click first Tool:Topology:Convert to Main,and after that unpress Edit topology.
6. Now comes the essential step: Activate MOVE and move all parts of your 'Convert to main'-'Pre'-Rigg inside the borders of your mesh-model, so no points are outside the model.
7. Now press Tool:Rigging:Bind. Depending on polycount this can action can take a few seconds. You can now pose your model by moving and rotating the the points. Highpoly meshes react a bit slower on the posing changes.

Keep to the following instructions for more easy and cleaner posing:

• Plan your rigg smart, keep it as simple as you can.
• Build the rigg from center to peripherie. Every Line in the topo can act as a root for all the following, the connection has a base where it's stable and an end where it moves. It's very important for an easy and right workflow in your posing that you build by this 'from center to peripherie'-rule. Then there should be no more wired behaviors when later posing them
• Of course you can work with clones of different subd-Levels to avoid changes on your master-mesh, simply unpress 'Bind' and select another Subd-level-clone.
• As it is not yet possible to scale the micro-zspheres to vary the amount of mesh they influence later, spread your rigg on parts where other rig-parts may have an unwanted influence. (f.i. When the arms-angles of your model are very close to the body)
• Make an completely connected rigg. Although you can topologize discontinuously, its better to have all micro-zspheres connected. Then you’ll always have a base Zbone that acts as a root for all that are afterwards connected, and you can move or rotate all (and so the connected mesh) with the root bone.
• As long as you move most of the rig inside the mesh-borders before you bind, Zbrush will also tolerate parts of the rig that remain mostly on the outer surface. So a combination of full rigging with surface-rigging is possible with this method, also on high-subd-levels.
• It is a good idea to store a copy of your topology before you convert into Main, so you can later reload it if you need to change something. After pressing Convert to main there is no way back.
• Once you have a desired pose press 'a' (preview) and you can store Morph and make another one and so on, then you can use the slider to obtain intermediate posing and Morph Differences. [tip by Andreseloy]
• Don't use the UNDO-command after you have binded the rigg to your model. Zbrush will jump instantly into data-nirwana. If something goes totally wrong with your posing unpress and press Rigging:Bind, or use a stored morph-target.
• In case you cannot move your mesh to position it before binding, you have masked micro-ZSpheres . Also a dark mesh-model indicates that. To solve this simply Ctrl + LMB-Klick-drag on a clear place of the canvas to unmask all.

For a more elaborate and illustrated version of this workflow, check out
the Topology Rigging tutorial by Rastaman. [ ]
You can get started right away with this Rigged averageman Ztool. Load the model and press Rigging:Bind. Provided by... Rastaman!



Transfering a topology rig to another mesh
Do you want to make some basic rigs and apply them to all your models? ZBrush3 can do it. Here's another brilliant workflow by Rastaman:

1. Load your master-rigg and the model you like to adjust it to into Zbrush.
2. Make your master-rigg the active tool.
3. Open Tool:SubTool, press Append and choose the model.
4. Click in the subtool-palette on the new appended mesh-topic to make it the active tool. All you do now will affect only the active subtool, in this case the mesh-model. The rigg will not be affected as long as you don't give him back the focus by clicking on its topic in the subtool-palette.
5. First we scale the mesh to the size of our rigg, so activate Scale. You can now use the Transpose function to adjust the size.
6. To see the rig underneath go to the Transform menu and activate the Transparance button.
7. Now we need to rotate to align it correctly to the mesh. Activate Rotate and make the adjustments.
8. Make some further corrections with Move, Scale and Rotate as needed to roughly fit the mesh to your rigg.
9. Switch to your rig by clicking Tool:Subtool and selecting the rig subtool. The colors of the mesh and the rigg change now.
10. Use Move and Rotate to adjust the (Micro-)ZSpheres of the rigg to their matching positions inside the mesh.
11. When you now try to bind the mesh on the rigg, you will notice that the mesh is not available in the Rigging: Select menu. To solve this problem go to Tool:SubTool and activate your mesh subtool, then press Tool:Clone to make a copy of your mesh.
12. delete the mesh from the subtool-palette. Click Tool:SubTool>Delete or only hide it via clicking on its eye-button.
13. make sure that the rigg subtool is active, so that you can see and open the Tool:Rigging panel. There, press Select and select the mesh, then press Bind.

Now you can pose your rigged mesh with Move or Rotate the way you like it. Press 'a' to see the mesh-preview. So far this has been only tested on a Convert to Main rig (see above).

Read the tutorial about Adapting rigs to other meshes for more information, Made by non other then Rastaman.

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For more hidden gems, read:

The Unofficial Guide to hidden features in the new Rigging and Topology of Zbrush3 by Rastaman.

Topology in action:

• Movie by Thomas Mahler
• Thomas does a nose job

More information:

• Read the Wiki about this subject.
• Read this older thread about retopologizing.
• A thread about topology in Zbrush2.

Q&A list

Q. Can you use topology on an object with subtools?
A. As of yet the topology tool only recognizes the active subtool. See above for a workaround.

Q. Is there a way to make the polygons more visible, like you could do in Zbrush2?
A. Transform menu > Quick mode on and Frame on. Shows the polygons (The Namek)
Extra info: Or the Frame button on the shelf. (Plakkie)

Q. How to delete a point ?
A. Alt Click on a point to delete it (Kramskoi)

Q. Is there a way to weld the points ?
A. None found. Delete the points you need welded and create and connect a new one on the desired spot.

Q. Is there a way to adjust your topology in Move mode while forcing the vertex moved to remain on the surface of the underlying model?
A. Moving created points breaks them away from their on-model position., as demonstrated by Bisenberger. At the moment it seems like that's inevitable. Something for Zbrush 3.5? (Plakkie)

Q. Is there a way to save a topology rig in progress?
A. Just Deactivate the Edit Topology Button, and then save the active ZTool, after reloading the ZTool, just activate the Edit Topology Button again, and work further. (Mouse_art)
A. You can save a retopo rig WIP and come back to it. You turn of Edit Topology and save the Tool. I tested this by saving the tool, quiting and reopening ZB3 and loading the Tool. Worked like a charm. I just hit Edit Topology again and ther was my repo rig. (Poda)

Q. Is there a way to create a mesh from the topolines that match up exactly?
A. To use the exact amount of polygons as you draw, go to Tool->Adaptive Skin, and set the Density Slider to 1. The Subdiv Slider from the Topology Tool has to be set to 1 as well. (Mouse_art)
Extra Info:you have to set Adaptive Skin Membrane (Mbr) to 0 if you want the low res for your new mesh to match the poly count from your retopo rig. I think Mbr defaults to 2 instead. I figured that out the first time I created a skin from my retopo rig. The weird part was that I could not get Reconstruct Subdiv to work on the skin. So I deleted it, changed the Mbr setting to 0 and made a new adaptive skin. (Poda)

Q. Is there a way to transfer the high sub details to the new mesh?
A. Yes! Turn on the 'projection button' in Tool:Rigging. (Ladysoul)

Q. Is there a way to convert the original topology of a model into a Topo-Zsphere structure, so you can edit it a bit instead of having first to draw all the topo-lines?
A. Yes! The procedure is explained in detail at the top of this thread under "Editing existing topology" (Poda/Plakkie)

Q. When you project your old details onto your new mesh, is there any way to copy over your texture or poly painting info? Or do you need to do retopolgizing before you do any texturing/painting?
A. If I understand correctly, polypainting stores the color information directly 'in' the geometry. With the topology tool you are making new geometry, and thus your polypainted info doesn't apply on the new model. I don't know about texture maps, yet. I think it's a good idea to do the texture/paint part after you have made the new topology. Anyone had different experiences? (Plakkie)

Q. When shifting topology vertices away from the mesh some of them seem locked, couldn't move them at all. [more a statement really ]
A. You masked them by accident. You don't get a visual clue, but trust me. Just play around with CTRL and LMB clicking and you'll be able to manipulate them again. (Thomas Mahler)

Q. Are there some functions like "edge loop", "edge ring", "making strip" "split"... ?
A. Maybe some day, but not now. Those tools would really help with retopoing zsphere armatures. Those things are still causing problems. I'd rather have metablobs I can retopo (like Blender), than trying to use Adaptive skin with Zspheres to get a clean mesh. (Crusoe the Painter)

Q. What's the quickest way to delete edges?
I am currently adding a new vert in the middle of the edge and deleting (Ctrl+LMB click) that. The edge gets deleted in the process. This seems to work fine but I would love to have a simpler, faster way. I think i tried Ctrl+LMB clicking directly on the edge and something bad happened.

Q. After working a little bit with the new topology tools, i tried to create a new topology as described on the wiki. The mesh/tool was created in ZBrush 2. When I hit the "edit Topology" button, i got a skin with lots of holes in it, and I don't know why. Before hitting the button the skin was ok! Does anyone know why this happens and how I can fix this?
A. Solved this problem, by taking the topology of Subdivision lvl 2 of the Mesh. Lvl 1 didn't work and gave those strange holes... (Train22)

Q. What do the Hide and Bind buttons in the Rigging and Topology menu do?
A. bind: allow to move the mesh reference. (Andreseloy)
Extra Info: movie by Andreseloy showing Hide and Bind in action.

Q. Is there any use for the Rotate mode?
A. Non found...

Q. Is it possible to mirror an existing topology mesh?
A. Nope.

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Any suggestion or corrections? Please post them in this thread!

Cheers,
Plakkie

The Namek

Here is started working on a new topology


and since i got the hang of it and was too curious to try out other stuff , i made a mask out of the new topology instead , decent alternative to mesh extract

Plakkie

Wicked mask! If he snorts, the two flaps will probably move outwards; that always gets a laugh on parties.

Is there a way to make the polygons more visible, like you could do in Zbrush2?

The Namek

Transform Quick mode on and Frame on. Shows the polygons

Jettatore

NM, sorry, back to the manual..

Plakkie

Ah, so it's hidden there, thanks Namek!

owendf

Great thread- thanks for starting.
I too have been playing with topology. I don't have too many answers, but I do have some questions to pose:
1) Notice how when you convert from the topology lines that you draw into a mesh that the base mesh you create is 4 times as dense as the lines you draw? In other words, the subdivision of the mesh is one higher than the lines you draw. Why? Is there a way to create a mesh from the topolines that match up exactly?
2) After drawing some topology lines (The vertices of which I think are size 0 z-spheres by the way), I switch to Move mode to adjust the flow. But when I move the vertices they are not contstrained to the surface of the model. Is there a way to adjust your topology in Move mode while forcing the vertex moved to remain on the surface of the underlying model?
3) Does anyone else find it very frustrating that there is no good documentation on this stuff?

Roja

Yes, quite
Thankfully I stumbled on this thread in which plakkie said to hold ctrl to set new start points..that makes it MUCH easier. I didn't see that mentioned in the wiki. All I was able to figure out on my own was that by placing the mouse cursor on the point that was active, deactivated it, but it didn't always work smoothly nor was it fast.

So thanks for that tip Plakkie!

tonytrout

Thanks for starting this thread guys and for the tips. Once I have made new topology, my original disappears, noob question but wheres it gone and how do I find it again

Ladysoul

Hi !

I'm playing with topology, and have some questions !!
- Is there a way to weld the points ?
- How to delete a point ?


anyway, Zbrush 3 really rock !
Kudos to pixologic !

kramskoi

Alt Click on a point to delete it

kramskoi

what I'm wondering is if there is a way to transfer the high sub details to the new mesh. Anyone know if I'm missing something?

Ladysoul

Thank you Kramskoi !

To transfert your high mesh details on your new mesh, you should check the "cyborg head tutorial" on the wiki about the procedure.


At a point the tutorial says to "press project on the tool rigging sub-palette" but the correct name of the button to press is "projection".

kramskoi

Thanks.... I just came across that in another thread. just imagine if there was a way to condense all of this info into just one thread! I guess that what the Wiki is for in the end.