Demo

[Mikaidesu]

Well I have been recently been working on my demo reel i plan on using zbrush for most of it and already started. Im having a few problems though like this one [ATT=228616]Screen shot 2010-12-04 at 8.03.42 AM.jpg[/ATT] [ATT=228617]Screen shot 2010-12-04 at 8.03.22 AM.jpg[/ATT]
I been trying to figure out how to get the edges in the face out and cant figure how so i was wondering if anyone knows without redoing the hole model or deleting alot of it. btw i dunno if i pout this post in the right place or not >.> oh and one other note does anyone know a good tut for doing fingers and hands in zbrush?

[oofnish]

Have you tried selecting the edges and using Maya's Uncrease Edges command? (I don't know how to do that in Maya, specifically, but I'm sure there's something like that, maybe someone else can give you a step-by-step)

[Ravis3057]

There are a few reasons this is occurring. My best bet is that you either have faces on top of faces ore your verts are not merged. Other possibilities are your normals are reversed in certain areas. This is maya 2011 and I haven't seen the problem displayed that way before (I am using 8.5), but one of those options would be my bet. Good luck on the problem.

On another note, I would consider reworking your edgelooops a little bit. Here is an example of what I think is a good wireframe:
Hope this is helpful.

[Julian_K]

I just wanted to emphasize what Ravis said. your mesh will give you quite some problems if you use it as it is. especially the cheek area. you are gathering 3 vertexes with 5 edges and one with only 3 there at the same place which will lead to pinches in Zbrush that you can't get rid of.

Ravis sample is excellent. there is a 5 edge vertex on top of his mesh's cheek, but in an area and context where the flow still works. obviously he does a lot of meshes for animation for which a good edge flow is also particularly critical.
now , teher might be people here who tell you for Zbrush only sculpting the topology doesn't matter much. while in most and moderate cases it doesn't matter as much as when animated, it still can can lead your sculpting traces into dead ends, where you just can't get rid of artifacts showing up. egdes which flow along with the shape you are going for are always better. for highpoly sculpting only your mesh should at least be an evenly spread grid with little to no 'anomalies' like the egde nest on your cheek. one vertex should share no less and no more than 4 egdes wherever possible.

[Mikaidesu]

thanks guyz helps alot Rav by chance you wouldnt have more images of facial typology like the last one would you?

[Julian_K]

a quick google search for good topology yielded these 2 links which really should get you started

http://wiki.polycount.com/ShoulderTopology

http://www.phungdinhdung.org/Studies..._modeling.shtm

[Ravis3057]

So, these days I don't typically use reference for wireframes, so my image collection no longer has too many examples, however here is an image a buddy of mine did a while back that I think is also a great example. You can see more of his work here at: www.tyshelton.com
These types of wirez will allow you to work much easier in Zbrush, with fewer complications. As you can see this image has very similar wirez to my image that I previously posted, there are some differences, but the same general principles are in play. I hope this helps.

[Piggy]

i dont get it.. why are we talking about line flows in a zbrush forum?

if you are going to use zbrush for your modeling demo reel, then the chance is that you don't actually need to worry about lineflows until you finalize your model. In fact, a complex line flow from your basemesh could and will distrub your work flow in zbrush.

this isn't 3 years ago when zbrush was still at its baby stage. People can now build an excellent model with a simple zsphere and worry about the topology later.

it looks like you are just starting learning box modeling in maya/max..if this is the case, i would strongly advice you to keep your modeling in maya until you completely understand how to redirect your line flow and get a good model in maya and maya alone. OR if you just want to learn zbrush, then you should learn how to sculpt in zbrush with a cube/sphere without having a complex basemesh from maya.


This isn't the first time i see people actually focus on line flows without having a good mesh in zbrush... and i am still suprise so many people would continue to give advice on how to get a good topology without explaining how useless and a waste of time it would without finishing your sculpting first.

[Mikaidesu]

on another not i worked on another head for a different character today and looked at the examples you guyz gave me im sure its not as great but just for pointers and i havent been modeling lately at all is why im doing this piggy. [ATT=228704]Screen shot 2010-12-05 at 4.23.38 AM.jpg[/ATT]

[ATT=228705]Screen shot 2010-12-05 at 4.23.55 AM.jpg[/ATT]

[Bas Mazur]

Can you post a sideview of the wire? It looks real nice

[rodsanchez]

great models on your website.

good topology is very usefull for sculpting in zbrush, it makes some parts of sculpting easyer! your topology looks perfect - great work!

rod

[Julian_K]

Piggy, you might want to read the above posts and your own again carefully, because what you just wrote can be pretty confusing for someone who is new to this.

If Mikaidesu is fairly new to this, which I assume by his post, then it is either way very useful for him to learn about line flow, or at least which topology works in Zbrush and which causes problems like pinching poles etc..

Now - yes if he can just start a model in Zbrush with Zspheres fore example, he is good to go and doesn't necessareky have to worry about line flow right away, but once he is done with the sculpting and wants to get his model out of Zbrush then what? Latest at that point he can need all the info he can get about how to best achieve a good retopo model.

furthermore, it all depends on what what one actually wants to do. If you you just want to sketch along and don't quite know yet with what kind of model you'll end up, then its by all means good to just load Zspheres and zsketch away. If you already have a pretty precise vision or a even a concept sketch of what you want to create, then starting with a base mesh which topology already supports what you envision, then I'd rather go with that, because a good line flow certainly doesn't hurt. especially when it comes to human faces, because all faces share a certain basic flow anyway, which is the reason why most good head meshes look very similar in terms of edge flow.

last but not least - understanding line flow, edge loops and good topology
naturally so you almost automatically build that way without having to think hard about it every time you model takes time and practice. I remember when I started that I spend more time trying to figure how to redirect edges, avoid n-gons and triangles while not shooting my polycount through the roof, than actually doing anything creative. if you do it often enough it starts to all come just naturally. it's just like with anatomy where first starting to study all the bones, muscles and tendons and their interactions can be slightly overwhelming until some day you know that stuff by heart.

bottom line - learning and knowing the basics NEVER hurts and give you freedom in your creativity on the long run.

[zber2]

I found this on edge flow quite a while ago but don't remember where I go it. Hope it helps.

[sadicus]

@ Zber2 Nice post.
@ Julian_K I agree. I still appreciate the look of well thought edge loops and line flow.

[Julian_K]

zber2 - if you follow one of my 2 links posted above you will know again where you found it