HELP! Corals and underwater stuff?

[joro]

Hello everyone,

I'm very new to ZBrush, I just finished reading the Practical Manual 2.

Can anyone pls give me some directions or examples on modeling underwater stuff like corals etc - very very fractalized objects. I need to model them and after that export them to Lightwave and render.

One big problem is that after applying the displacement map in Lightwave (of course during render time) it tooks a lot of memory for a single coral and i'm worried about will it be possible to render that at all, I mean all the underwater life...

In fact, what I'm tryingh to make is an advertisement video in Finding Nemo style, but not exactly, I need to make it VERY realistic, like real fish etc, not like cartoon or 3D for kids. It should be REAL. As I didn't find enough might in modeling small details in LW, I had to switch to ZBrush and learn it for 3 days, but I'm really new at it still...

So? Anyone can give advice or help? It's quite of emergency as I'm in a big hurry for the terms of the video.

See this link
www.sdv-studio.com/sss.jpg (http://www.sdv-studio.com/sss.jpg)

It didn't take me a lot of time to make this in ZBrush, but rendering it in LW it became about 630 000 polygons, and adding SSS really made thing quite slow. Even on dual xeon 2.4 with 4GB ram and a Wildcat III video card!

See what I want to achieve:
www.sdv-studio.com/Leather.jpg (http://www.sdv-studio.com/Leather.jpg)

Those small little "flowers" should sway and open and close. There should be a feeling of LIFE there. But if i have to render 600k polys for a single coral, what is needed for 50-60 corals ??? Maybe a CRAY?

If anyone can help with some advice or whatever (examples, tutorials), I will be really grateful.

Waiting for you,
George

[Frenchy Pilou]

Example 01 (http://www.pixolator.com/zbc-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=015658)
Example 02 (http://www.pixolator.com/zbc-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=015561)
Script for seascape (http://www.pixolator.com/zbc-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=015491)
Challenge with a lot of Tuts (http://www.pixolator.com/zbc-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=015652) :cool: :cool: :cool: Explore the tread!
Somptuous tut (http://www.pixolator.com/zbc-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=011680) :cool: :cool: :cool: slide the page !
Bon courage!
Pilou

[Abyssis]

Is no problem, joro, show on my underwater-series :cool:

http://www2.zbrushcentral.com/uploaded_from_zbc/200407/user_image-1089129698xry.jpg

and other ones... :)

[Abyssis]

oh, merci bien, Frenchie, for PR :tu: :D :D

[Frenchy Pilou]

It's a pleasure :D
Pilou

[joro]

Hey

Thanks everyone for the cool links.
But I think you should have a look at:
www.garf.org (http://www.garf.org)

(if you haven't already) to see what i'm talking about. Especially the wallpaper section!

Can anyone explain pls how to clone an object (say like those small flower elements) over the bigger body of the coral, and after that animate them? ZBrush can generate very cool static things like a paint program, but i need to animate everything in Lightwave.

Thank you
George

[Frenchy Pilou]

Best thing is made your initial modele in Zbrush
Export it and in your your 3D animation prog make the clone !
In different orientations!
Like this just one modele to animate :)
Pilou

[mahwok]

phew, tough one ...
i have absolutely no idea about lightwave, but assuming that it works more or less like all the other 3d packages (good guess, isn't it?) i'd say, 'this will be complicated'!

since you need a helluva lot of detail in your scene and even need to animate it, all i can say is: instantiate! instantiate! and then some ... dunno about LW, but in max/cinema (those 2 i know) it's possible to scatter 'references' to a single obj over another objects surface and animate them individually, which won't alleviate your 'millions of polys' problem, unfortunately.

but: another approach might be, to model animate and render most objects separately and compsite them together (with 'aftereffects', 'combustion' or such) i remember a nemo 'making of' and they composited a 'lot' to achieve that detail.
you'll probably need a 'layered' impression with rocks, corals etc. vanishing into a blue ish haze anyway ..

and: your corals 'tendrils' (?) will probably be tiny, so you might be able to cheat and use opacity maps insted of 'real' polys (again, generating those maps from prerendered single animated objects), presuming you don't move around your camera too much.

and: 'xfrog' may be worth a look ( look here (http://www.xfrogdownloads.com/greenwebNew/index.htm) ) .. its cinema plugin offers a neat feature to make e.g. the branches of a tree sway towards an animated sun and more .. plus: it excels at modeling/generating tree and flowerlike structures.

and: instead of rendering surface detail in LW, try baking it into the texture, might save a few 100k in polys.

well, i don't have a real solution either, but maybe i gave you some ideas :)
keep us updated on your progress, sounds interesting :)

cheers and good luck!

[joro]

hi again

the complicated thing is not the "instances", the hardest part is the rendering. zillions of polys...

i'm sure i have to use compositing and i will. that thing about texturing polys works, but my camera will be drawning and moving

see the storyboard here:
www.sdv-studio.com/storyboard.jpg (http://www.sdv-studio.com/storyboard.jpg)

anyone pls tell me how to clone tiny objects on another object (like fine tentacles etc) and export the whole thing as a singl object with displacement and color textures

greetings
george

[joro]

i found a way to "merge" objects using MultiMarkers tool

but how to keep the displacements?

after merging it flattens the surface of the objects, only colors are kept

greetings
george

[Frenchy Pilou]

Open the sub menu of the Menu Markers :)
Here you can enable Material, texture etc...
Pilou

[joro]

oh thank you so much !!!

can you give me a tip for reducing polygon count?

i need to export a low poly smooth model that i will be able to convert to metanurbs in LW and after that subdivide it during render time and apply the displacement map

george

[Frenchy Pilou]

From Zbrush ?
It's exist a Optimize function in the Menu tool/Modifiers/Deformation/Optimize :)
But test the visual result :)
Maybe Better is made a lowpoly as Adaptative skin!
Pilou

[joro]

http://www.garf.org/100/gorg/paragorg1000750.jpg
http://www.garf.org/34/3rdd1194850.jpg
http://www.garf.org/37/feed/duck1000865.jpg


any ideas how to make this?

george

[Frenchy Pilou]

He he You have not seen this Tut ? (http://www.pixolator.com/zbc-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=011680) (slide the page)
With it you can make all that you show !!!
Pilou
Ps garf.org (http://www.garf.org) is a very good site ! :cool: :cool: :cool:

[Abyssis]

YAAAAAH, Frenchie and joro, http://www.garf.org/ is my absolutely favorite site :tu: :tu: so much material to learn..Thank you both, fellas :D :D

(Frenchie, unbelieavable, but I have seen PGhetty´s thread ´bout deep-sea for first time
:eek: thanx again for remembering)

[joro]

hey guys

does anyone know how to fix this problem:

i make a model using zspheres and then at subdiv=7 i create a lot of displacement and color texture stuff. when i try to make a normal map i get the following picture with those holes in the texture (after about 26 minutes of computation!).i tried modeling with other tools - but rezults are the same. i need the normal map for a low poly model in lightwave (no TANGENT!!!)

pls help if you can

http://www2.zbrushcentral.com/uploaded_from_zbc/200407/user_image-1089460526gpu.jpg

george

[joro]

p.s.

i tried lower resolutions and lower subdiv levels - same problem

[Abyssis]

I think, you should flip your texture...

[joro]

hi again

flipping worked - no holes now. thank you.
but there is sth really bad about that texture. pls compare the 2 renders below and the previous screenshot.

http://www2.zbrushcentral.com/uploaded_from_zbc/200407/user_image-1089519568oao.jpg

http://www2.zbrushcentral.com/uploaded_from_zbc/200407/user_image-1089519606cxs.jpg

the darker image is made using the normal map from ZBrush. the other one is made using microwave's normal map baker. 7344 polys

any ideas about fixing that difference?

george

[Abyssis]

joro-fella, I´m happy, that "flipping" is working... with other question is better to ask some ZB-gurus here :cool:

Keep posting, I like it :tu: :tu:

[joro]

hey abyssis

thanks a lot ;)

who are the "gurus" and how to ask them? i'm not very much into forums really, this is my second time. first one was some years ago. :(

btw - anyone here got ICQ or other messenger?

george

[joro]

Here we go :)

http://www2.zbrushcentral.com/uploaded_from_zbc/200407/user_image-1089966801gny.jpg

Rendered in Lightwave.


please help me to make the fish !!!
i need nice realistic swimming fish, jelly fish and so on.

give me ideas pls. links, whatever.

george

[Abyssis]

very nice underwaterscene, joro :tu: I like it. Why do you render in LW? Look at my underwater-scenes, ZB can make awsome awsome awsome renderZZ (as U can see at third post in this thread) :tu: :tu:

Which one do you want, joro? I can post here something 4 you, I have very big archive, because underwater is my PASSION :D :D

p.s.: how did you make the microwave piece??

[joro]

hey abyss

see this
www.sdv-studio.com/marine.avi (http://www.sdv-studio.com/marine.avi)

zbrush cannot make animations
neighter many other things like a real 3d package, it's good just for modeling, isn't it?


do u have some messenger - icq, yahoo, msn???
i will explain about microwave there

george

[Abyssis]

thx 4 link, joro :D

(I had have ICQ, but it was sooo bad and unsecure... at the time I have nothing and I´m happy about, bcs I have more time to work :cool: maybe some links about microave?)

bye

[joro]

hello again

i have a problem with an octopus that has over 3M polygons

when trying to build a displacement or normal map in zbrush it needs ages and in fact never computes

any ideas?

joro

[Abyssis]

hi again, fella :cool:

I think, it´s problem of memory, you should have more than 1GB (better 2GB)... and your GraphCard is???

cu...

[aminuts]

Can't believe I am giving up one of my TOP SECRET resources to help a fellow Zbrusher....oy.....frying pan to my head! :rolleyes:

a superb resource for fish and flower models (http://toucan.web.infoseek.co.jp/3DCGE.html)

enjoy!

[loiosh]

Wow! What a wonderful resource. Thankyou Thankyou Thankyou!!!

[joro]

Abyssis

One of my machines (the main i work on) is Dual Xeon 2.4 with 4GB DDR RAM with wildcat III video card

i don't think it's a matter of hardware only

loiosh!
thanks a lot for the great source

soon i will post some new images :)

keep in touch fellas ;)

;)

[joro]

ooops

i had to thank aminus not loiosh sorry :p

[aminuts]

No problem, just post a pic soon with those cool fish models! I have been meaning to do something with them but have not had the time. That website is a true gem for the models it has. Not alot but what they did, they did very well.

I hope they help ya complete your project. :D

[joro]

hello everybody

here is the video
www.sdv-studio.com/videos/videos/marine_15sec.avi (http://www.sdv-studio.com/videos/videos/marine_15sec.avi)

see ya!

:)

[Frenchy Pilou]

Vodka + sea water = good mixing ****tail ? :D
Refreshing video :)
Pilou